SmashWiki:Talk pages

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Policy.png This page documents an official SmashWiki policy, a widely accepted standard that all users should follow. When editing this page, please ensure that your revision reflects consensus. If in doubt, consider discussing changes on the talk page.
Shortcut:
SW:TALK

This policy details what talk pages and user talk pages are, and how they are to be used.

Talk pages[edit]

Every article on the SmashWiki has a corresponding talk page, and are linked by the "discussion" tab. Talk pages are pages used to discuss matters pertaining to the content of the corresponding article, such as asking about the verification of some information in the article, or if a section marked for cleanup should have the cleanup tag removed.

Proper usage[edit]

The following are examples of what proper usage of a talk page would be.

Discussing an article's deletion/move/merge/split[edit]

==Deletion==
I think this article should be kept, as its subject is indeed notable to the Smash community because... ~~~~

Obviously, discussion of an article's potential deletion/move/merge/split should be done on its talk page. Though when discussing such, it's advisable you post beyond "I support/oppose this" and/or parroting what another user said, especially if the proposed action is contentious; such posts will be typically ignored when deciding to go through with the action or not, as any proposal on the wiki is not determined by sheer "vote count".

Discussing erroneous tagging[edit]

==Stub==
This article has a stub tag on it, but what else could we add to it? ~~~~

If an article has a quality or "In need of X" tag that you think doesn't apply to the article, you should discuss it on the article's talk page. Usually it's fine to remove such tags without any prior discussion, but if a previous attempt to remove the tag had been reverted, you should discuss it on the talk page before attempting to remove it. The inverse applies as well; you can usually add such tags to articles without prior discussing, but if the tag has already been removed, it should be discussed before re-adding it.

Potential information to insert in the article[edit]

==Combo list==
I was thinking we could add a list of combos to Captain Falcon's article. Would this be appropriate information for the article? ~~~~

If you have an idea for information that can be added to an article, but are not sure if it belongs in the article, are unable to add the information yourself, or just want to discuss with others about information that can be added, bring it up on the article's talk page.

Potential information to remove from an article[edit]

==Controversy==
I think the controversy section in this article should be removed, I don't see how it is notable. ~~~~

If you think a section or other large parts of an article should be removed, it's strongly advised you discuss on the talk page before attempting to remove it; removal of large amounts of information can be misconstrued as vandalism, and it's likely to be contended.

Fact checking[edit]

==Chain throw list==
I noticed this article has a list on how well Falco can chain throw every character. Could someone verify if the information is factual? ~~~~

If information in an article seems off but you don't know for sure it's not factual, bring it up on the talk page and someone else can verify if the information is indeed correct or not.

Discussing conflicting edits[edit]

==Ness' down tilt==
User X, stop re-adding Ness' down tilt to the meteor smash list, it is not a meteor smash as... ~~~~

When another user reverts your edit or removes information you added, do not undo the revert and re-add the removed information; instead bring it up on the talk page and discuss it with the user(s) reverting you. In the case of vandalism or the adding of obvious falsehoods, it's acceptable to not attempt discussing it on the talk page if a user undoes your revert, though in which case, you should notify an administrator instead of continuing the edit war.

Improper usage[edit]

The following are examples of improper usage of a talk page.

Opinion[edit]

==Falco is overrated!!!==
Falco is so cheap! All he can do is shoot lasers and chain grab people. He should not be rated so high on the tier list!!! He's just a little chicken! ~~~~

Talk pages are not to be used to discuss your opinion on the subject of the article. SmashWiki does not care if you think Ganondorf is a great character that people shouldn't think is bad, or that edge hogging should be banned because it's cheap. Telling SmashWiki your opinion does nothing to improve the article, and just wastes space on the talk page. Save these kinds of posts for the forums.

Asking for advice/tips/strategies[edit]

==Tips for Ice Climbers==
Hi, I recently started playing Ice Climbers in Brawl. Can anyone give me some tips on how to play them? Thanks!! ~~~~

Talk pages are not to be used to ask for help/advice about something relating to the subject of the article. SmashWiki is not a help site for Smash Bros, and questions asking for advice on talk pages do not help improve the article. Such questions should be asked in the forums.

Irrelevance[edit]

==Boomerangs==
Yes, but I can tell Link always has boomerangs. ~~~~

Simply, if it's not relevant to the article's content, don't post about it.

Musings[edit]

==Mewtwo==
Wouldn't it have been cool if Mewtwo had returned in Brawl? ~~~~

Like with opinions, SmashWiki doesn't care about any musings you may have about an article's subject, and such musings do nothing to help improve the article.

Repetition[edit]

If what you have to discuss has been discussed to resolution before, and you got nothing new to add or nothing happened since the discussion's resolution to make it outdated/irrelevant, do not bring the old discussion back up.

Arguing tier placements and matchups[edit]

==Tier list is wrong==
The tier list on here is wrong, this is what the true tier list is... ~~~~

Do not try arguing tier placements and the listed matchups on the wiki; SmashWiki does not decide the tier list nor matchups, we report what the Smash Back Room decides. Arguing tier placements and matchups on here is a waste of your time. If you really feel that the SBR is wrong, argue it on Smashboards, not here.

Complaining about an article's content[edit]

==This article sucks==
Why is there so little information?! Why instead of information on how Toon Link can get KOs is the article telling us how Toon Link's hair moves with the wind?! ~~~~

Do not use talk pages to complain about issues you have with an article's quality. SmashWiki is a collaborative project worked purely on a voluntary basis that anyone can help with, and it takes a significant amount of time to complete it; SmashWiki is not complete and there will be information the Wiki should have but doesn't at the moment. As such, if there are any issues you have with an article's content, don't complain to the wiki about it. Such complaining does nothing to improve the article, and just annoys other users who are already likely aware of any problems the article may have. Instead, help us and make such improvements to the article yourself; anyone can edit the wiki, including you. Or, if you're completely incapable of making such improvements, at least politely point out on the talk page what you think the article specifically needs.

User talk pages[edit]

Shortcut:
SW:UTPG

User talk pages are talk pages that are used to contact users on the SmashWiki. It should be noted however, that a SmashWiki account is not an e-mail account, Facebook page, or in any way primarily a social networking utility. As such, extended conversations that are not associated with the wiki should not be held on user talk pages. The primary use of a talk page is to contact a user about their contributions to the wiki.

For example:

==Your Rayquaza edit==

Hey, the edit looks good, blah blah blah. ~~~~

Do you have any ideas as to what the weak point could be? etc etc etc. ~~~~

(and so on)

Any replies to an existing message are to be answered on the page that the conversation began on. The alternative, to always answer on the other user's talk page, is unwanted for multiple reasons: it makes conversations difficult to follow, it requires loading two pages to read the whole passage, and it makes it extremely difficult for other users to participate in the discussion. As such, after you write on someone's talk page, be sure to check back regularly, add the page to your watchlist, or watch the recent changes to see a response.

Beyond conversations about edits to the wiki, minor outside conversations are perfectly acceptable. However, do not extend these into being chat rooms, message boards, and/or e-mail accounts. All edits show up on recent changes, and continuous messaging floods the changes and makes it difficult to spot other edits. If you feel that you would like to continue a conversation with someone, find a way to communicate with them outside the wiki or on Discord. For example:

==Brawl?==

Hey, you seem like a pretty good player; do you want to play sometime? ~~~~

Sure, e-mail me at its-a-me@mushroomkingdom.ntd. ~~~~

In a nutshell, user talk pages are a vital part of the wiki, but users are to follow these guidelines when using them:

  1. They are primarily for questions/comments about edits to SmashWiki.
  2. Do not split a conversation across multiple pages if possible.
  3. When conversations begin to leave the relevance of SmashWiki, take them elsewhere.
  4. Images and videos should be linked to, not embedded.

Posting on talk pages[edit]

Shortcut:
SW:POST

The following are guidelines that must be followed when posting on all talk pages, as well as forums:

  • After every post, sign your comment with four tildes, like this ~~~~. For more information about signatures, read SmashWiki:Sign your comments.
  • Each individual discussion should start with a == level 2 header ==; whenever a new subject is brought up, a new section should be started (unless it is a direct continuation of an existing topic). Using the "new section" tab to make an edit will do this automatically - note that this is not possible if the page does not yet exist, so it must be added manually.
    • Consider avoiding generic or non-specific section headers such as "Yo" or "Hey", as distinct and on-topic headers generally make it easier for others to discern the topic.
  • New discussions must be placed at the bottom of a page.
  • When replying directly to a specific comment, indent your comment appropriately by placing colons (:) at the beginning of the comment. For how many colons to use, use one colon more than the comment you're replying to did. This allows talk pages to flow more smoothly and be easier to follow, as well as letting others know who you are replying to. If the indentation starts becoming too much, reset the indent with the reset indent template.
  • Do not place images uploaded to the wiki, videos, or pictures linked from other sites, on talk pages. These are never necessary for using talk pages in their appropriate means. They can be handled through a simple link (either internal or external).
  • Keep your post legible, and nondisruptive to the page. Do not use coding to make the text of your post larger or to be of another color. Do not use ALL CAPS in your posts. And do not use excessive punctuation marks at the end of your posts. These do not help make your point any clearer, and just disrupt the talk page, as well as annoy other users.
  • Never post in a talk page archive. If you have something new to add to an archived discussion, start a new discussion about it on the talk page.
  • Similar to the above, do not directly reply to an old comment, and even if the discussion isn't archived, do not comment on old discussions that have been resolved, unless you have something new to add. As a general rule, if the last comment in a discussion is over a month old, and the discussion appears to have been resolved, do not post a comment in it.
  • Some talk pages and forums have specific posting rules, such as Requests for adminship, and the Smash Arena. When posting on these pages, abide to their posting rules.
  • All talk page posts must adhere to SmashWiki's policies, such as SmashWiki:No personal attacks.

Editing and removing comments[edit]

Editing and removing your comments[edit]

For the most part, editing talk page comments after they been posted is discouraged and typically not allowed. There are some exceptions when it comes to editing your comments however:

  • Fixing spelling and grammar errors in your post.
  • Adding a signature if you forgot to sign. However, this must be done immediately, and before another user adds the unsigned template to your unsigned comment. Removing an unsigned template and adding your signature in its place will not be allowed.
  • Moving your comment and its replies to a more appropriate place.
  • Adding information you intended, but forgot to add to your initial post, though it is recommended you add this information in a second post. If you are to add missing information to your original post however, do so immediately, and before another user responds to your comment.

When it comes to removing your talk page comments, you are to never delete them. The only possible exception to this is when you post something you think is not needed (such as if you're asking a question that you noticed has been already answered on the talk page), and remove it immediately before another user responds to it.

However, if you made a statement or said anything you wish to retract, you may add strike tags <s></s> to the offending portion of the comment to signify this.

Editing and removing other users' comments[edit]

Under usual circumstances, you are never to edit another user's comment. The only exceptions to this are:

  • Adding an unsigned template to an unsigned comment.
  • Moving the comment to a more appropriate place.
  • Cleaning up formatting for readability; for example, closing an unclosed tag that is affecting subsequent comments, scaling down large images, removing the leading space character (which encloses text in a dashed box and prevents text wrapping), or modifying the indentation.

Likewise, removing another user's comment is typically never allowed. The only exceptions to this are:

  • Removing clear vandalism and spam posts.
  • Removal of links to sites containing malicious scripts or patently offensive material.
  • Removal of email addresses and other personal information used without the user's consent. (These revisions should also be deleted- please leave a note on the admin noticeboard.)
  • Removal for archiving purposes (see following section).
  • Removal to move the post to a more appropriate talk page. When moving comments to another talk page, mark the move using the {{moved}} template in both the source and destination pages.
  • Removing userpage like content from an ip's talk page, or in the case of administrators, deleting a talk page that is deemed to not be needed (such as the talk page of a deleted article, or the talk page of a vandal/spam account). In the case of userpage like content on a user's talk page, it should instead be moved to their userpage.

If part of a post is removed, a replacement note detailing what was removed should be inserted (such as <link to shock site removed>). However, if a comment was removed in its entirety due to the above exceptions, there is no need to insert a replacement note, unless the removed comment had received a reply, in which case replacement notes such as <spam removed> or <vandalism removed> should be inserted.

Archiving[edit]

An archive is essentially an old talk page. Archiving is used to clean up an excessively long talk page, and provide easily accessible references for past discussions. Archives can be added to any talk page on SmashWiki. This guideline will explain how to archive and offer some tips on what to avoid.

When to archive?[edit]

As a rule of thumb, 32kb or more is when you should archive, but this is not a formal standard. However, if you are to let your user talk page go well beyond this, you may be warned by a sysop to archive, where failure to adhere may result in punishment.

How do I archive a talk page?[edit]

See Help:Archiving talk pages.

Archiving guidelines[edit]

  • Archive a talk page by sections. Avoid archiving a section only partially, since it will break continuity.
  • Archive only inactive discussions. Consider moving relevant sections out of an archive should a topic get discussed again; avoid discussions on archives.
  • Empty remnants of sections moved to other talk pages do not need to be archived if they are irrelevant.
  • Personal attacks can be immediately archived if there is no ongoing discussion about them occurring on the page.
  • After archiving, add a visible link on the original talk page to the newly created archive.
  • Explain that you're archiving in the edit summary.
  • An archived talk page is still a talk page. All relevant policies and guidelines still apply.
  • Users should generally not archive talk pages in the user spaces of others without permission.