Talk:Character matchup (SSBM)

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Good call on the re-align, MaskedMarth. My resolution doesn't seem to suffer the problem you were describing, but it really just looks better on the right anyway. *thumbs up* -- Randall00 22:49, February 13, 2007 (GMT)

Haha, thanks, and good job on the whole article! MaskedMarth (t c) 02:31, February 14, 2007 (GMT)

Merge with Matchup[edit]

This belongs on the Matchup article. 03:03, February 18, 2010 (UTC)


Is this going to be redesigned to match the other two? Miles (talk) 21:06, March 5, 2010 (UTC)

That's the plan currently. But before that, I'd like to ask if anyone can provide a newer version - from what the article says, it's badly outdated. I'll fix it up soon in either case, but of course it'd be better if I didn't do it and have to redo it. Toomai Glittershine Toomai.png The Stats Guy 22:50, March 5, 2010 (UTC)


I always assumed that this wiki was primarily American and I've seen "color" as opposed to "colour" often enough so what's with favour? Food for thought.highway Image:highwaypumpypic.jpg|20px pumpy 02:09, April 19, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I made the stuff, and I'm Canadian, so there's your reason as to why it's as such. We don't have any "American speeling" rule, so I just type it how it is. Of course, someone can change it, but it'll get changed back for consistency if he doesn't change very single one. Toomai Glittershine Toomai.png The Table Designer 02:51, April 19, 2010 (UTC)
I could change it if necessary, but I'll just leave it as is right now as it's not really doing anything.highway Image:highwaypumpypic.jpg|20px pumpy 13:24, April 19, 2010 (UTC)

Mewtwo's matchup on bowser[edit]

Perhaps this is not the right place, but there is no way Mewtwo's matchup with Bowser is 50:50. Mewtwo has a chaingrab on Bowser, and he can chain him up to %100. From there, a simple back throw will KO Bowser. I'd say Mewtwo has at least a 60:40 matchup against Bowser. Please move this to the right place if this doesn't belong here. Mr. Anon (talk) 05:58, June 20, 2010 (UTC)

This is the stuff you talk about in forums, but I'll respond to your comment anyways. I believe you are underestimating Bowser. First off, Mewtwo can not chain throw Bowser any where close to 100%, the down throw is too strong to be able to chain throw for that long. Secondly, the up throw would be a much more effective finisher on Bowser as he is not a fast faller. Now Bowser has some good attacks in his arsenal. Bowser's fair, usually considered his best attack in Melee, is much better than any of Mewtwo's aerials, and Mewtwo does not have a proper way to deal with it. Bowser also has the Whirling Fortress, his other great attack. It has only 5 frames of start up, along with very high base knockback. It does have low knockback scaling, but considering Mewtwo is so light and floaty, Mewtwo is going to be KOd by it once he has reached the 100% mark. While there is much more that goes into a matchup than this, you provided a simple reason as will I. The point is that Bowser's fair and Whirling Fortress are going to make a bigger impact on this matchup than Mewtwo's throws. Omega Tyrant TyranitarMS.png 13:51, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
Um, Mewtwo can chain bowser to %100. I tried this on a level 9 CPU and it did not break free until 106%. Rather than doing the last D throw, anyone could simply use the Back or Up throw to finish Bowser, making it a Zero Death Combo. Mewtwo can also do this chain throw to other fast fallers, and this is why I think his tier position should be higher. Mr. Anon (talk) 16:30, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
The fact that you did it on a cpu doesn't make it a 0-death chain throw. Actually do it against a competent human player. I've played Melee for years and I know for a fact that Mewtwo cannot chain throw anyone beyond 100%. Omega Tyrant TyranitarMS.png 16:33, June 20, 2010 (UTC)


The chart is outdated. There is a new one on the works, here is the link Zeldasmash (talk) 10:44, 23 December 2010 (EST)

A new one that is incomplete accomplishes nothing. In addition, with 6 tables on there, a consensus on whether or not to include them must exist. Hope that they make a single one.MegaTron1XD:p 11:05, 23 December 2010 (EST)

I will keep an eye on that topic. Once it gets going I will see about updating ours. I would appreciate not being pestered about it. Toomai Glittershine ??? 12:54, 23 December 2010 (EST)

Vertical column[edit]

taking a look at it today and if i knew how to would have rearranged the vertical column to mirror the horizontal one. Although it does not bother me i feel for consistency that they should be mirror and not mis-matchedFE pro (talk) 15:32, 3 February 2011 (EST)


Um... this chart looks mis-aligned at the bottom, since the mirrors make a perfect diagonal when the horizontal and vertical columns are different resulting in Kirby having a "mirror" matchup with Pichu, Ness with Kirby, G&W with Yoshi, etc. I personally don't know how the matchups should look, so I can't really fix it. Can someone else fix it? Warp Star1.jpgT.c.w7468 12:46, 26 February 2011 (EST)

I figured out what went wrong. I adjusted it so that the matches are accurate (the mirror matches line up), but as of now it still isn't aligned yet. I think when the tiers changed, someone adjusted either the row or the column but didn't adjust the other, but the alignment still needs to be fixed.Warp Star1.jpgT.c.w7468 16:37, 27 February 2011 (EST)
Okay, I figured out what needs to be done-- the columns need to be rearranged (not the rows) and the rows need to be recolored.Warp Star1.jpgT.c.w7468 16:46, 27 February 2011 (EST)
I was supposed to be the one to fix it (since im the one who switched the heads in the corresponding order) but i had other things to do, leaving it in the hands of other users. But unfortunately, no one had interests in fixing it. I must apologize for this. Zeldasmash (talk) 16:52, 27 February 2011 (EST)
I fixed the chart and re-aligned the columns for the template; I hope I didn't make any mistakes...Warp Star1.jpgT.c.w7468 13:35, 6 March 2011 (EST)

The Chart[edit]

I am starting to think we should change it to Brawl's Matchup Chart system. The current chart has numbers like +2 and +3 on its first form. We could use it like that one. Zeldasmash (talk) 12:57, 10 June 2011 (EDT)

What does the current active SSBM matchup chart say? Toomai Glittershine ??? Da Bomb 15:15, 10 June 2011 (EDT)
The same. Zeldasmash (talk) 15:35, 10 June 2011 (EDT)
Same as what? Where's the topic of the current active chart? Toomai Glittershine ??? The Inconceivable 16:08, 10 June 2011 (EDT)

"Uneven" matchup[edit]

There's a mistake on this page: the Bowser->Pichu matchup is said to be even, but the Pichu->Bowser matchup is said to be a small disadvantage. Which one is correct? RickTommy (talk) 06:13, 17 January 2012 (EST)

It's even. Omega Tyrant TyranitarMS.png 06:33, 17 January 2012 (EST)

Bottom row...?[edit]

What's the very bottom row for...? There aren't any characters lined up there... ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe Nutta. 16:30, 18 June 2015 (EDT)

It's the average, same as the last column. Miles (talk) 16:58, 18 June 2015 (EDT)

Editing the matchups?[edit]

The current matchup spread seems to be inaccurate for a lot of characters(especially Yoshi), and certain characters have more even/positive/negative matchups than before. Is there a way to edit the individual matchups, or does an entirely new chart have to be put in there? I just want to know how the old chart would compare to the new one, and finally see the mostly accurate matchup spread for each ind. character. Hopefully the chart can be updated soon enough. ShEiKsTeR!? (talk) 08:50, 16 September 2017 (UTC)

For stuff like matchup charts and tier lists, we keep to the most official releases from SmashBoards (and so far there hasn't been any other reputable group that's eclipsed them to our knowledge). So we can't really change anything until we see they've got a new official release, and I don't think many people care about matchup charts nowadays. Toomai Glittershine ??? The Aurum 09:04, 17 September 2017 (EDT)