Forum:Spirit battles

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Alright. About damn time I put this up.

To put it bluntly: I really dislike the formatting of the inspiration column in the spirit battle pages. It makes short points that break the flow of reading, sometimes pointing out blatantly obvious information, and, in worse cases, making speculative statements that stretch harder than Wii Fit Trainer's taunts. I'm proposing that this formatting be changed to combine points of similar information, removing anything not as well as making an effort to not make short, blunt points that take away from any information that could (and theoretically should) be provided. While this does make the points a little bit longer, which can potentially be an issue in a cramped column of information such as this one, I believe priority lies in how we present the information itself, rather than how it looks on the page.

As an example, let's use the newly released Roxas. I'm putting these behind show/hide bars so that this page isn't insanely huge.

This is how it's formatted at the time of posting this forum.

Spirit			Battle parameters							Inspiration
No.	Image	Name	Enemy Fighter(s)	Type	Power	Stage	Rules	Conditions	Music
1,507		Roxas	•Sora (160 HP)		13,800	Hollow Bastion (Dive to the Heart, Roxas)	•Health Recovery •Move Speed ↑ •Attack Power ↑	•Stamina battle •The enemy has increased attack power after a little while •The enemy has increased move speed after a little while •The enemy starts the battle with a Killing Edge	Fragments of Sorrow	Spirit Battle inspiration: Sora is the origin of his Nobody, Roxas. The stage references the Station of Serenity, the location of Roxas' boss battle in Kingdom Hearts II Final Mix. The stage and music represent Roxas' Dive to the Heart station in Kingdom Hearts II. The Attack Power ↑ and Move Speed ↑ rules reference how Roxas uses quick and powerful attacks during his boss battle. The Health Recovery rule references the Cure spell in the Kingdom Hearts series. Sora starting off with a Killing Edge references how Roxas dual-wields his Oathkeeper & Oblivion Keyblades. Other trivia: This spirit's Support type references Roxas' role in aiding Sora in the Kingdom Hearts series. This spirit's Neutral type references Roxas' status as an ally and enemy in the Kingdom Hearts series. This spirit's Weapon Attack & Move Speed ↑↑ ability further references how Roxas uses quick and powerful attacks using his dual Keyblades during boss battles.

This is nearly identical to the way I had made it, with some minor touchups since that edit of mine, but is nonetheless how I think stuff like this should be formatted.

Spirit			Battle parameters							Inspiration
No.	Image	Name	Enemy Fighter(s)	Type	Power	Stage	Rules	Conditions	Music
1,507		Roxas	•Sora (160 HP)		13,800	Hollow Bastion (Dive to the Heart, Roxas)	•Health Recovery •Move Speed ↑ •Attack Power ↑	•Stamina battle •The enemy has increased attack power after a little while •The enemy has increased move speed after a little while •The enemy starts the battle with a Killing Edge	Fragments of Sorrow	Spirit Battle inspiration: Roxas is Sora's Nobody in Kingdom Hearts II. He is able to dual-wield Keyblades, primarily using the combination of Oblivion and Oathkeeper, referenced here by Sora starting off with a Killing Edge. The overall battle represents Sora's battle with Roxas in Kingdom Hearts II Final Mix, where Sora meets with Roxas in The World That Never Was, and is pulled into battle at the Station of Serenity. Initially just a cutscene in Kingdom Hearts II, the scene was expanded upon in Final Mix to turn it into a fully-fledged boss battle. The Attack Power ↑ and Move Speed ↑ rules reference how Roxas uses quick and powerful attacks during boss battles. Other trivia: This spirit's Weapon Attack & Move Speed ↑↑ ability further references how Roxas uses quick and powerful attacks using his dual Keyblades during boss battles.

Obviously this is one example, but I hope that it still gets my idea across. Aidan, the Spooky Rurouni 13:00, October 26, 2021 (EDT)

I like this. I feel like there's a lot of bloat and unnecessary info in these tables, specifically in the "inspiration" table, and what is on the Roxas table is just ridiculous. I'd prefer having precision rather than having more trivia points just to explain the obvious. CookiesCreme 13:10, October 26, 2021 (EDT)

A more cohesive short paragraph seems like an obvious improvement over choppy, disorganized bullet points. Miles (talk) 13:15, October 26, 2021 (EDT)

I feel like you could still use points rather than one single continuous paragraph—some things aren't necessarily connected to one another in the context of reading the information (I've always felt different points create a nice break in the reading). For instance, I wouldn't be fond of combining the first and second points for my Roxas example, and rather intentionally separated them, because one of them discusses Roxas's origin and the reason why Sora represents him in the battle, and the other discusses, albeit somewhat indirectly, why the fight takes place on Dive to the Heart. Aidan, the Spooky Rurouni 18:29, October 28, 2021 (EDT)

Sounds like a good idea to me, especially if it results in less vertical space like in the example and reads more organically. The only issue I see is that it might take more effort to produce and maintain. I do still believe that we should look into something better than the inspiration column because putting non-battle stuff there is a little messy, but that should be its own discussion lest we lose focus. --CanvasK (talk) 14:50, October 27, 2021 (EDT)

I don't think it'd take a whole lot of unnecessary effort, we already try to make information presentable on the rest of the wiki as it is. I agree that having non-battle stuff in there is kind of messy, but I also agree that that might need its own discussion on another day. Aidan, the Spooky Rurouni 18:29, October 28, 2021 (EDT)

Nearly over a month later, but here's a bump to this discussion. Aidan, the Thankful Rurouni 12:06, November 17, 2021 (EST)

I like it. Especially for a franchise like Kingdom Hearts, where refs are either not well known or difficult to comprehend, enforcing a minimum standard to conciseness it’s necessary. Plus, it doesn’t Have the same need for constraints that SW:TRIVIA does. Black Vulpine the 🦊Furry🐺. Furries make the internets go! :3 00:23, November 18, 2021 (EST)

Full support with nothing constructive to add. Sincerely, Samuel the Banjo-Kazooie Boss. 00:40, November 18, 2021 (EST)

Bumping one final time (hilariously, once again nearly a month later). Should nothing majorly happen in this forum, I plan to implement stuff once finals is done, so theoretically after this week. Aidan, the Festive Rurouni 00:17, December 7, 2021 (EST)

I like it: I've complained about the trivia bloat before, and have been wanting it fixed for a while. We need some form of standard of how these columns should be written. Omega Toad, the Jolly Shiny Litten. (Seasons greetings!) 00:33, December 7, 2021 (EST)

This is a closed discussion about an accepted proposed change on SmashWiki. It remains for archival purposes.