Talk:Ken Sugimori

From SmashWiki, the Super Smash Bros. wiki

Delete[edit]

This really dosen't have any relation to Smash Bros.T.testLP (talk) 06:46, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Helped art direction. Read it for once.--MegaTron1XD:p 10:04, 16 November 2010 (EST)
Yeah, if he helped on the game, he should have an article. ☆The Solar Dragon☆ 12:51, 16 November 2010 (EST)

this belongs on a pokemon wiki....this man has nothing to do with smash brothersGig (talk) 15:20, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Yah, no. Read it. He helped direct the Pokemon department. I suppose that a person who created most of the Pokemon designs aren't notable? For SSB series too. You should read the article carefully. It's only a few paragraphs.--MegaTron1XD:p 21:07, 16 November 2010 (EST)

Bump[edit]

I would merge with Pokemon Universe article. --HavocReaper48 22:55, 31 August 2011 (EDT)

  • I agree. ƋoӄԏoяΠɛəи99 {ROLLBACKER} 23:01, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
  • Agree. It's really small notability Smash Bros wise. Blindcolours tappity Tappity TAPPITY 23:04, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
  • Agreed. --RoyboyX Talk 13:14, 24 August 2012 (EDT)
  • Oppose. He worked on the Smash Bros games, and is a major director of the Pokemon games. See Shigesato Itoi. Mr. AnonAnon.pngtalk 13:17, 24 August 2012 (EDT)
    • Actually, looking back at the discussio on that talk page, Miles proposed we merge all the producer articles into one. Mr. AnonAnon.pngtalk 13:18, 24 August 2012 (EDT)
  • I guess we could do that. --RoyboyX Talk 13:27, 24 August 2012 (EDT)

Deletion...again[edit]

Per my tag, I support deletion of the article.~~ John John3637881 Signature.png HUAH! 10:44, 22 May 2017 (EDT)

Support. ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 22:26, 27 May 2017 (EDT)

As mentioned above, I suggested (in 2011, damn) that we make a page for people whose Smash contributions are major enough to mention without being major enough to warrant their own page. While I would keep someone like Itoi separate from such a page as a co-owner of characters, Sugimori probably should be reduced to a section on such a page. Other people who could be included on the list include other illustrators who worked on the SSB4 character posters (e.g. Nomura), Nintendo employees involved in Smash promotion but not to the degree of Reggie (Treehouse staff?), maybe condense Miyamoto's article in as well due to his smaller role in relation to Smash, I dunno. Regardless of whether we create such a page, I will agree though that Sugimori doesn't have enough of a role in Smash in particular to warrant his own page here. Miles (talk) 23:11, 27 May 2017 (EDT)

Apparently, everyone ignored your merger suggestion and just went on with life lol. I would be open to a merger, but deciding who gets onto the "list of developers" page could tricky. Do we put only people like Reggie or Miyamoto, or should we include everyone from the credits of every Smash game because there's not a good cutoff? I think that seems excessive, but it seems like we should at least have the credits of each game on some page. I personally feel that Itoi getting a page seems somewhat odd, but because his name appears on the main screen of the game, I guess there's a better case for him.
Either way, I'd like for this to finally get resolved one way or another. John John3637881 Signature.png HUAH! 00:13, 28 May 2017 (EDT)

I agree. With that, I will approve on this! Dragonfirebreath25 (talk) 23:15, 27 May 2017 (EDT)

Oppose sure, lemme just keep putting the deletion template on an article until I get the result I want. Jeez it's the U.S election all over again. The way I see it, if he made a contribution to smash, he deserves a page, even if it was minor. Alex Parpotta (talk) 04:27, 28 May 2017 (EDT)

You highly exaggerate the situation, and I only joined the wiki in late 2014, so it's not like I had anything to do with the first two decisions. The case for keeping this page is weak if we don't have pages for similar people who made equally-minor contributions to Smash. We should either finally go with Miles' suggestion or delete the page. I mean, why don't we have pages for the art directors of Metroid, Donkey Kong, Fire Emblem or any other series on this wiki?
On that note, for the sake of not removing any info, I now support Miles' suggestion for a merge, provided we actually do it this time. John John3637881 Signature.png HUAH! 12:45, 28 May 2017 (EDT)
I support a merge as well. I've created an outline of what to include. Nyargleblargle.pngNyargleblargle (Contribs) 22:21, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

I think that a list of significant developers is a great idea...however I wouldn't want to see Iwata or Sakurai...or even Miyamoto or Reggie lose their articles to this. Other smaller devs such as this should be covered in some way, and I think a list of this fashion is the way to do it. Serpent SKSig.png King 22:54, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

Yeah even before reading this talk page my gut wanted to go with a merge. That seems wisest. Ganonmew, The Evil Clone 20:56, 31 May 2017 (EDT)

Sure, I'll go for a merge. ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 22:44, 31 May 2017 (EDT)

I think a merge would be the most optimal choice. Area51Guard.png A51 Trooper 07:42, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Unless anyone feels the draft is incomplete, I'll move it to the mainspace tomorrow and turn the smaller articles (such as this one) into redirects. Nyargleblargle.pngNyargleblargle (Contribs) 15:55, 4 June 2017 (EDT)
There's a few issues I have with your draft; namely:
  • It should probably have a {{clr}} at the end of each section. The current layout with pictures dangling into the next sections constantly looks messy.
  • I don't think Itoi should lose his page to this, as I mentioned previously (he co-owns characters and that puts him on par with company relevance). Miyamoto is also a borderline case.
  • The "uses text from Wikipedia" templates are too bulky to be used that way. Maybe find another way to indicate that or paraphrase our way out of reusing their text at all?
Just some thoughts. Miles (talk) 16:17, 4 June 2017 (EDT)
  • I cleared the end of every section except the ones where it would have created a ridiculous amount of white space (Iwata and Itoi, to be more specific).
  • I'd debate keeping Itoi's page, but if we could adjust it to read more like an company article (if that makes sense) later down the line, while focusing the dev stuff on the list, that would be okay. I'd say Miyamoto isn't closely tied enough to Smash for a whole article, but that might be its own debate, and I'm open to suggestions.
  • Turns out somewhere along the line, a lot of the prose in the original articles got intensely paraphrased to the point where our content barely resembles Wikipedia's in structure.
Is this a good compromise? Anyone else have thoughts? Nyargleblargle.pngNyargleblargle (Contribs) 20:43, 4 June 2017 (EDT)
I disagree that Miyamoto and Itoi should lose articles, being that both own and co-own characters (and items, and certain stages). It also just seems wrong to not fully cover one of Nintendo's most recognizable developers in Miyamoto, even if his contributions to the series are minimal.
This does open up some questions though, Do we give Aonuma an article for Brawl's Sheik model? Do we give one to Koji Kondo for being the original composer for so many Smash Tracks at this point? Do we give Bandai-NAMCO devs articles, because they were directly involved in Smash 4? Serpent SKSig.png King 21:00, 4 June 2017 (EDT)

That's the line I'm trying to figure out where to draw. My proposal:

  • Devs that have made several major contributions to a Smash Bros. game (like Sakurai and Kondo) or legally co-own IPs involved in Smash Bros. (like Itoi) get their own article.
  • Devs that have made a couple of major contributions to Smash (like Sugimori and maybe Bamco devs) get a mention in the list.

Is that fine? Nyargleblargle.pngNyargleblargle (Contribs) 13:17, 5 June 2017 (EDT)

That seems pretty reasonable to me. Case-by-case discussion on some of the fuzzier cases will probably be necessary no matter how we phrase the guidelines for inclusion. Miles (talk) 13:23, 5 June 2017 (EDT)

I still think it would look better if Itoi and Iwata had the clear template. A lot of whitespace is easier to look at than a lot of content. Besides that, I'm good with everything that's been said. ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 14:28, 5 June 2017 (EDT)

What if we had sections for all of the devs that are to receive (or already have) main articles, then have a section for "Minor developers", which would list the less notable ones like Aonuma, Sugimori (if we are getting rid of this), and the Bamco guys? Could put Itoi there too if we decide to merge that. Serpent SKSig.png King 00:19, 6 June 2017 (EDT)

That's not necessarily a bad idea, but I don't think there's any good reason to split them up, either. Just seems unnecessary. ---Preceding unsigned comment added by you. Or maybe DatNuttyKid. 00:39, 6 June 2017 (EDT)