Talk:Fighter ability

Deletion discussion

I'm seeing a fair amount of inconsistency and disagreement on this page as to what mechanics are "passive". For example:

• Jigglypuff being launched on shield break is not anything special other than a very high shield break leap attribute, so is it really passive?
• Peach has to do an input to get her float, so how is that passive?
• Olimar has to do a move to get his followers, so isn't that no longer passive compared to Popo or Rosalina?
• Cloud's and Joker's meters are mostly passive but can also be actively charged, so should that count?
• Ink comes from specific Inkling attacks, it boosts all sources of damage, and it goes away no matter what it lands on - so which part of it is passive to the Inkling?
• Is K. Rool's belly armour really passive if it has to be specifically enabled during certain animations?

The list goes on. In short, I think it's too hard to establish the definition of a "passive ability" in a correct/useful way that the average player will understand, and this is why I suggest the page be deleted. Toomai Glittershine The Cloronic 06:45, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

I feel like we shouldn't delete it just yet, however we instead try to define the word more clearly. If we hae a more clear definition then we will be able to deterimine the difference from a passive, and just something unique in a charecters moveset. Also i think joker and clouds are still passives in the sense that while you can effect the meter, you don't have to in order to use it. XtraTalk Edits 07:22, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

Maybe it should be called Unique mechanic or Fighter ability and so on. Anyway, in my opinion what they have in common is that not general, not about passivity or not.--Capstalker (talk) 08:29, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

I wouldn’t split the page either, as then there would be disagreements on what fits in what category. I think a better proposition would be to rename this page to “special character mechanics”, as there are some mechanics that bear no resemblance to anything else another character has (such as Ryu and Ken’s inputs), but aren’t truly passive. Lou Cena (talk) 12:05, May 3, 2019 (EDT)

Should we count Dr. Mario’s stat modifiers as a fighter ability

After renaming this page, I think we can come to a pretty good conclusion on what qualifies on this list: something that would not really be able to be replicated on another character if you just changed some moves. These abilities have to be coded separately from the moves (such as type effectiveness, or tough guy) or are multiple non-special moves in place of a proper one. At this point, there seems to be only one that has been argued to not count: Dr. Mario’s stat modifiers. Do those count? They could technically be replicated on him without the external modifiers, but the fact that Doc has an extra thing coded on him makes me believe it should count. Lou Cena (talk) 20:29, May 30, 2019 (EDT)

• As the user who made the original edit, no. It is very unusual that Dr Mario's stats are multiplied in real time (either directly or through hard-coded equipment) rather than being baked into his move data as with most other clones. However, unless this has a special effect on custom equipment or spirits, the fact that it could be replicated by just precalculating the numbers leads me to believe that it doesn't quite count. b2jammer (talk) 16:41, June 1, 2019 (EDT)

Name change

Someone on the main page proposed a move, and while I agree "fighter ability" probably isn't the best name, I'm not keen on "fighter gimmick" either. Is there a better name we could come up with? ~ Serena Strawberry (talk) 00:45, November 16, 2019 (EST)

That was me, and that’s because I universally see these sort of things referred to as "Gimmicks". That’s also a pretty bad name, but since they don’t have an official name, the next best thinn would be to use the most common fan name. 209.198.210.220 00:48, November 16, 2019 (EST)

"Gimmick" is used fairly commonly in the fan community, but not as a professional term, I think; it implies something less integral and more aesthetic, like how Incineroar has the gimmick of taunting after every move it makes. The term used most commonly among professionals is "unique mechanic", I think? I'd like to hear some more input on this. ~ Serena Strawberry (talk) 01:03, November 16, 2019 (EST)

"Unique mechanic" is also reasonable. If it’s what most professionals refer to these things as, then that works. "Gimmick" and "Unique mechanic" also get the point across better than "Fighter ability", though after hearing "unique mechanic" I must agree that it gets the point across slightly more efficiently than "gimmick". 209.198.210.220 01:24, November 16, 2019 (EST)

I think passive ability is also a good name that is often used in other fighting game communities. Either this or unique mechanic is fine by me, gimmick is too colloquial and imprecise, not to mention it is often used for things that aren't a passive (i.e. "nair is Ike's gimmick). Rdrfc (talk) 14:57, November 16, 2019 (EST)

"Passive" was passed up, though, since a lot of these mechanics aren't passive and require input from the player to activate (see above). "Unique mechanic" seems to be a good compromise, though. ~ Serena Strawberry (talk) 15:07, November 16, 2019 (EST)

Naming it a "unique mechanic" can be misleading, since a mechanic may be shared with a clone or a different fighter entirely, meaning that it's no longer unique. For instance, Link's passive shield is shared by his clones, Young Link and Toon Link, as well as the Hero; Ryu's 1-on-1 facing and input special moves are shared with his clone, Ken, as well as Terry. Nokii — 16:16, November 16, 2019 (EST)

That's true, but in this case "unique" doesn't necessarily mean "one-of-a-kind"; it's mostly to oppose with a "universal mechanic", like spot-dodging. ~ Serena Strawberry (talk) 16:27, November 16, 2019 (EST)