Editing Talk:The Akaneia Build

Aren't we jumping the gun a bit here? A page was made for Remix but nothing was said about Akaneia, and it definitely currently doesn't have the popularity to back it up compared to the vanilla game, in contrast with Remix and PM/P+. [[User:Rdrfc|Rdrfc]] ([[User talk:Rdrfc|talk]]) 03:19, February 13, 2022 (EST)

:I agree, the page randomly pops up without discussion/consensus at all. And is there even a serious competitive scene yet for this mod compare to Remix and such? [[File:Grand Dad.png|23x20px]] [[User:NaughtyPigMario|<span style="color: red;">'''NPM'''</span>]]  [[User talk:NaughtyPigMario|''<span style="color: blue;">Morr!?</span>'']] [[File:NaughtyPigBoi.jpg|23x20px]] 05:05, February 13, 2022 (EST)

This page should not have been made. If we're going to make pages for mods, they're gonna have to be a lot more notable than this. I nominate this page for deletion. ''[[User:Alex the weeb|<span style="color: blue;">'''Alex'''</span>]] the [[User talk:Alex the weeb|<span style="color: red;">'''Weeb'''</span>]]'' 07:37, February 13, 2022 (EST)

Agree with deletion. I've only heard of The Akaneia Build through the volleyball minigame, which was really popular for a time, but other than that I haven't heard about much from the project at all. [[User:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia;color: black;">Cookies</span>]][[File:CnC Signature.png|20px]][[User talk:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia; color: black;">Creme</span>]] 17:44, February 13, 2022 (EST)

I think it should stay for now. It does have a competitive scene, albeit nowhere near as big as Project M, but no mod will ever be as big as that. Competitive scenes for mods will be smaller now to avoid the mod receiving a cease and desist from Nintendo like Project M did. It could receive a big popularity boost later on like with Smash Remix, so completely deleting the page would be a waste of time. [[User:Diddy Kongstar|Diddy Kongstar]] ([[User talk:Diddy Kongstar|talk]]) 23:15, February 13, 2022 (EST)
:Smash Remix is also not as big as PM but it still went through the process to get consensus to get a page. We don't make pages on the ''possibility'' of something being big or relevant. If the page is decided to be deleted and you want to keep the content, you can always move it to your userspace. --[[User:CanvasK|CanvasK]] ([[User talk:CanvasK|talk]]) 08:11, February 14, 2022 (EST)
:Much like [[Smash 2]] and [[Diet Melee]], this wasn't made with consensus and should instead be in [[Gameplay modification]]. Agreeing with deletion. [[File:725.png|20px]] '''[[User:Omega Toad|<font color="red">Omega Toad</font>]] [[User talk:Omega Toad|<font color="green">the Jolly Shiny Litten.</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Omega Toad|<font color="lightskyblue">(Seasons greetings!)</font>]]''' 08:32, February 14, 2022 (EST)
:No, no, no. We don't make articles pre-emptively just in case something becomes more notable later on. When it comes to fan projects, such as mods, they need to have a high level of notability to have their own articles, or the Wiki will be flooded with articles on fan projects. ''[[User:Alex the weeb|<span style="color: blue;">'''Alex'''</span>]] the [[User talk:Alex the weeb|<span style="color: red;">'''Weeb'''</span>]]'' 11:59, February 14, 2022 (EST)
:The page can just be restored as it is now if Akaneia becomes a big deal one day so I don't see how deleting it would be a waste of time.--[[User:Rdrfc|Rdrfc]] ([[User talk:Rdrfc|talk]]) 12:08, February 14, 2022 (EST)

== Mainspacing ==

So, three years after the above discussion about this page's deletion, I'd like to reignite the topic of having this page mainspaced. 

In my opinion, considering the high level of quality with this mod (outright making custom details to create a time capsule-like feel that stays true to the era of Melee's original release), as well as it being the first Melee mod to add full-on new content to the game (beating out Beyond Melee, which [https://www.reddit.com/r/SSBM/comments/1brzdik/what_happened_to_beyond_melee/ apparently] has ceased development btw), ''and'' there being an entirely separate mod that uses it as a base, I think there is enough argument to move this page out of userspace territory. Yes, strictly speaking, its numbers aren't as high as something like Smash Remix or Project M (but let's face it, nothing's beating out PM lol), but it's still undeniably big, and worth covering in detail, especially since we have a number of other mods covered in detail to roughly the same extent as this page currently does, even outside of those two.

Though, as an aside, while I myself have made pages for [[User:Aidanzapunk/Sonic (TAB)|Sonic's]] and [[User:Aidanzapunk/Tails (TAB)|Tails's]] movesets, I will specify here and now that those are just for fun, and I don't think it necessary to have full character coverage a la PM. Granted, I wouldn't ''oppose'' it, but it's not something I'm pushing for (and also, there's no guarantee that I'll put pages up for the other five characters <s>Sonic bias kicking in, sue me</s>). [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: yellow;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: white; text-shadow: 0 0 2px black;">'''the</span> <span style="color: purple;">Nonbinary</span> <span style="color: black;">Gamer'''</span>]] 22:48, June 3, 2025 (EDT)
:Bumping this. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: yellow;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: white; text-shadow: 0 0 2px black;">'''the</span> <span style="color: purple;">Nonbinary</span> <span style="color: black;">Gamer'''</span>]] 13:39, June 11, 2025 (EDT)
:'''Support'''. With how much effort was put into it, plus acceptance from several in the ''Melee'' community such as Mew2King and Hbox (M2K at least streamed himself playing the mod), I think this mod has received enough recognition in the community for it to have its own page. [[User:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia;color: black;">Cookies</span>]][[File:CnC Signature.png|20px]][[User talk:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia; color: black;">Creme</span>]] 14:02, June 11, 2025 (EDT)
::Bumping this discussion once again. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Gamer'''</span>]] 13:27, July 8, 2025 (EDT)
::'''Support.''' [[User:Aykrivwassup|Aykrivwassup]] ([[User talk:Aykrivwassup|talk]]) 13:39, July 8, 2025 (EDT)
::'''Support''' This is easily one of the Melee mods with the most effort put into it with it essentially becoming Melee's equivalent of PM/+ and Smash Remix, and strictly speaking, if [[Diet Melee]] is able to have a page. (although I haven't been as active lately to know if it was agreed upon), there's no reason why this should be ignored. [[File:Toad.png|20px]] '''[[User:Ultimate Toad|<font color="#0AF">Ultimate Toad,</font>]] [[User talk:Ultimate Toad|<font color="blue">the Toad Warrior.</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Ultimate Toad|<font color="#7B5BEE">(I'm the best!)</font>]]''' 13:50, July 8, 2025 (EDT)
::You could probably guess from making the draft, I '''support''' mainspacing this. It has so much effort put into it and coverage from competitive players and the general Smash community is growing. I know it will be a bigger problem later on regarding mods getting pages since we mainly want to cover official Smash games, but this is one of those mods we can make an exception for with how close it feels to an official game. [[User:Diddy Kongstar|<span style="font-size:10pt;background:#28282B;border:solid FF0000 5px;border-radius: 4px;padding:1px 3px;color:#FF0000">Diddy Kongstar</span>]] 18:13, July 8, 2025 (EDT)

== Linking to character pages ==

Ignoring the fact that discussion for mainspacing this article is still ongoing (consider this a long overdue bump for that discussion btw, only one person besides myself has contributed to it), I don't think that this is a matter of waiting for discussion of making character pages to "inevitably get brought up"—we've never operated on a "just in case" mindset when it comes to page creation, we either have something or we don't. This page was moved to userspace because it was believed that, at the time of its creation, it was too early for it to exist in the mainspace alongside mods that were accepted into the mainspace, like Project M and Smash Remix, and the reason I reignited discussion on mainspacing this article ''now'' is because its popularity has changed, and I believe it's in a much better standing in terms of the Smash community as a whole. However, whether or not character pages should be made for this mod is an entirely separate discussion, and those pages can be linked to in such a discussion when it is held, not on the actual page itself. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Gamer'''</span>]] 10:59, July 7, 2025 (EDT)
:If it's decided that there shouldn't be character pages, it's a simple one button undo. There's no harm in leaving the links there for the time being. Furthermore, considering this IS technically Diddy Kongstar's page, they have the right to include the character pages as part of the proposal if they so choose. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 18:22, July 7, 2025 (EDT)
::Firstly, this is a draft and therefore not exclusively Diddy Kongstar's page. The intention was to mainspace from the start. [[SmashWiki:Ownership|People don't really "own" pages on this wiki to begin with]], [[SmashWiki:Ownership#Userspace pages|not even user pages]].
::Secondly, considering the bare minimum level of effort put into the fighter pages that aren't ones that I myself made, I personally don't think that they would make that great an argument in terms of a proposal for mainspacing in the state that they are. I already don't think the Smash Remix pages should've been uploaded in the near empty state that they are right now, it's not a great look—and to be clear, I acknowledge that it'd be unfair for one person to be left with all the work, but if a page is being created from scratch, it should look more like [[Special:Redirect/revision/1623607|this]] and less like [[Special:Redirect/revision/1623507|this]].
::Thirdly, I say again, we ''do not'' do things "just in case". That's why this page was drafted in the first place. I made the pages for Sonic and Tails for fun, and because I wanted to. If we happen to reach a point of consensus where users are in agreement that character pages should be made, then the change will be made, but not right this second. Let it be known that I am not in opposition of covering the fighters in pages, but the discussion of mainspacing concerns strictly this article. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Gamer'''</span>]] 19:55, July 7, 2025 (EDT)
:Seeing as the main page has recently been mainspaced, I feel this discussion should be brought up again. I have made character pages for all of the other characters in The Akaneia Build, with the biggest thing still missing in them is technical data like damage values and stats. They are still drafts as of now, already available if the consensus agrees to having fighter pages for them. [[User:Diddy Kongstar|<span style="font-size:10pt;background:#28282B;border:solid FF0000 5px;border-radius: 4px;padding:1px 3px;color:#FF0000">Diddy Kongstar</span>]] 12:02, July 25, 2025 (EDT)
::I'm personally against having character pages for any mods unless they have a notable tournament presence. While Akaneia has a competitive scene, it's still significantly smaller when compared to its original scene; both PM and Remix have scenes that are comparable if not bigger than their base game's scenes. If we create character pages for Akaneia characters, what's stopping us from creating ones for mods like Brawl-, who also had some competitive play but never took off like PM? Or heck, any mod that gains enough traction for it to receive a page? It's a slippery slope that I don't want to cross. [[User:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia;color: black;">Cookies</span>]][[File:CnC Signature.png|20px]][[User talk:Cookies and Creme|<span style="font-family: Georgia; color: black;">Creme</span>]] 12:30, July 25, 2025 (EDT)
:::I second Cookies' comment, since the core of this wiki isn't to focus on the fanmade material, and I do think that Akaneia should perhaps be a bit bigger in terms of its popularity to warrant full, dedicated coverage like that—however, I would like to point out that Brawl- [[Brawl-/Character changes|has a page dedicated to its character changes]]. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Gamer'''</span>]] 13:15, July 25, 2025 (EDT)
::I can take or leave character pages, but I do think the page needs its own category, if only because it currently has more assets than every other non-PM/SR mod in the mods category combined and it's a bit overwhelming. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 14:55, July 25, 2025 (EDT)
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