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| The above is an old post, but it shares my sentiment. I find the home advantage section unnecessary, and it does not provide any useful information for the article. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 13:51, 20 September 2011 (EDT) | | The above is an old post, but it shares my sentiment. I find the home advantage section unnecessary, and it does not provide any useful information for the article. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 13:51, 20 September 2011 (EDT) |
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| I've removed it (see [https://www.ssbwiki.com/index.php?title=Home_stage&diff=1797644&oldid=1757205 edit summary]); I guess if anyone's against the removal please post your reasoning here. Some tiny bits of it were actually objective and intentional (e.g. Minecraft World, Summit traction), but those are already mentioned on their own pages. [[User:Zowayix|Zowayix]] ([[User talk:Zowayix|talk]]) 20:58, May 13, 2023 (EDT)
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| == Master Hand? == | | == Master Hand? == |
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| :Also, hate to resurrect a discussion from 8 years ago, but is the “Home Stage advantage” section necessary? As far as I know, nobody actually thinks that, and it’s not actually in the gameplay. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 12:55, July 5, 2019 (EDT) | | :Also, hate to resurrect a discussion from 8 years ago, but is the “Home Stage advantage” section necessary? As far as I know, nobody actually thinks that, and it’s not actually in the gameplay. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 12:55, July 5, 2019 (EDT) |
| ::Bump. Adding the section for {{forwiiu}} to ask if we need it, because Classic Mode uses any stage with any character, and All Star Mode doesn’t even use every home stage listed for each character, unless there’s a third use for them. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 18:00, July 5, 2019 (EDT) | | ::Bump. Adding the section for {{forwiiu}} to ask if we need it, because Classic Mode uses any stage with any character, and All Star Mode doesn’t even use every home stage listed for each character, unless there’s a third use for them. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 18:00, July 5, 2019 (EDT) |
| :::It's probably fine to leave it. Although the idea of a “Home Stage advantage” doesn't apply, ''Ultimate'' is more so listing which characters and stages belong to the same series. With the exception of R.O.B., which could be enough to leave the section alone. [[User:Wolff| Wolff]] ([[User talk:Wolff|talk]]) 18:16, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| ::::If the purpose is to list which stages and characters belong in the same series for Wii U and Ultimate, then they feel unnecessary. The pages {{forwiiu}} and [[Super Smash Bros. Ultimate]] convey that much better because the characters and stages will share a symbol with each other. The other games (including {{for3ds}} do have a specific use for home stages in Classic Mode and All Star Mode, and [[past stages]] and [[Mushroom Kingdom]] were always coded to not be home stages, while Wii U and Ultimate just list which stages and characters are in the same series, minus R.O.B.’s being Wrecking Crew and a couple other characters not being unlocked in stages from their series. Also, the suggestion to remove the Home Stage advantage part was not specifically related to Ultimate, but rather because it’s an arbitrary thing that I’ve never seen suggested once outside of this wiki. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 18:30, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| I do have to admit, the whole "fight this character on this stage" thing has kinda been phased out in games after Brawl... [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''Aidan'''</span>]], [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: blue;">'''the Rurouni'''</span>]] 18:31, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| :We should probably keep it in for {{for3ds}} though. WFT and ROB both have no stages in 3DS (using stages without a fighter instead for Classic and All Star Mode), so the Home Stage section does have a valid use in that game. It’s just Wii U and Ultimate (plus that “Home Stage Advantage” section) that might have to be removed. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 18:37, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| ::Aside from Duck Hunt in ''Wii U'' due to an update, I guess for ''Wii U'' & ''Ultimate'' can mention how it does not make a difference or that the idea seemed to have been dropped. [[User:Wolff| Wolff]] ([[User talk:Wolff|talk]]) 18:56, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| :::If the idea has been dropped, I’m not sure we even need a table for it. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 19:01, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| ::::Actually, it was the ''3DS'' version to what I was referring to with Duck Hunt. And yes, a table probably would not be needed as it would just say along the lines of the characters fighting on their own series with R.O.B. being the only exception in ''Wii U'' and not present in ''Ultimate'' as you can choose the stage. [[User:Wolff| Wolff]] ([[User talk:Wolff|talk]]) 19:17, July 5, 2019 (EDT)
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| Bumping. Also, FYI Wolff, despite the title of this section, this isn’t just about removing Ultimate’s section from this page, but also about removing the sections for Wii U and the “Home Stage Advantage”. [[User:Lou Cena|Lou Cena]] ([[User talk:Lou Cena|talk]]) 15:40, July 8, 2019 (EDT)
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| == Delete? ==
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| With how messy the whole concept has become in later ''Smash'' games, it feels like the page contents would just be better off in other articles. For example, ''Ultimate''{{'}}s contents would just go under [[Unlockable character#Super Smash Bros. Ultimate]] and [[Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Official Site]]. ''Smash 4''{{'}}s contents (both versions) are partially wrong and nearly meaningless besides a list of universes, and ''Brawl'' is almost the same with the sole exception of "R.O.B. goes on Mario Bros. and the Mario characters don't", which is already mentioned at [[Classic Mode (SSBB)]] and [[All-Star Mode]]. ''Melee''{{'}}s contents are similarly on [[Classic Mode (SSBM)]] and [[All-Star Mode]], while ''Smash 64''{{'}}s contents are on [[1P Game]] and [[Unlockable character]].
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| Thoughts?
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| I suppose the biggest strike against this is that all the stage pages would need editing, because all of them have "Home stage to" in their templates. However, some of this is already wrong (e.g. [[Jungle Hijinxs]] should be no one's home stage, because it's never used in for Wii U's All-Star). Other usages are even weirder (e.g. [[The Lake]] says it's Rayquaza's home stage). [[User:Zowayix|Zowayix]] ([[User talk:Zowayix|talk]]) 06:08, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| :Alternate idea: we could remove stuff on this page that
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| :* Is already under [[Unlockable character]], on the grounds that it can never apply to all characters
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| :* Belongs on [[Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Official Site]]
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| :* Or is just a plain universe-by-universe mapping from characters to stages
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| :Then this page would just be dedicated to listing the few exceptions that are left. ''Ultimate'' has nothing, ''for 3DS'' Classic has nothing, ''Smash 4'' All-Star has extremely little at best, ''Brawl'' has nothing except the R.O.B. exception, ''Melee'' Classic has very little, and ''Smash 64'' has only the Mushroom Kingdom exception. Thoughts? [[User:Zowayix|Zowayix]] ([[User talk:Zowayix|talk]]) 06:36, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::I actually agree with you on this, the whole concept of "home stages" is just repeated and/or obvious information. I was considering removing them from the template last year/early this year, but stopped due to the massive amount of work and lack of consensus (or any discussion at all) on the matter, as well as interest in concepts that needed about as much work but were way more necessary to address (attribute tables). [[User:Unnamed anon|Unnamed anon]] ([[User talk:Unnamed anon|talk]]) 11:42, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| :::The removal of home stages from the template would take multipule willing contributors at best, which may be a number too low to be done in just a couple of days. Because of this, '''I oppose the deletion'''. [[User:Jordan2009|Jordan2009, the Sora Main]] [[User talk:Jordan2009|Talk here]] 16:16, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::::FYI, sheer numbers shouldn't be a deterrent in the removal, especially for something either inconsistent or plain uninteresting. It's also not terribly big; it's also only 130 pages, which might sound like a lot but since I'm currently working on an even bigger project of attribute tables, this is small enough to handle, so I'm willing to remove a bulk of them. It actually takes less brainpower to remove it fully 130 times instead of thinking about what qualifies as a home stage (due to most pages listing home stages incorrectly in the infboxes) potentially less times. If I haven't made it clear, I '''support''' both this page's deletion and the removal from the infoboxes. [[User:Unnamed anon|Unnamed anon]] ([[User talk:Unnamed anon|talk]]) 19:12, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| :::::@Jordan2009 The existing template uses are already wrong and would need the same amount of work (or more work) to fix regardless, per the Jungle Hijinx and The Lake examples. [[User:Zowayix|Zowayix]] ([[User talk:Zowayix|talk]]) 21:34, May 15, 2023 (EDT)
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| I always found the concept of a "home stage" in Smash to be nebulous and it basically boils down to "whatever stages you happen to fight the character on in single-player modes", while when you're labelling several different stages as "home stages" for a character because not even the individual modes are consistent where you fight them on, it just gets really silly. This lack of consistency additionally makes the "home stage" parameters in infoboxes a fucking bloated mess of no actually useful information. Plus as mentioned way up on this page in the "Home advantage" section, there is no intrinsic advantage a character gets on their "home stage", so the concept has no real gameplay applications. At best, this page basically just amounts to a mass of trivia that conglomerates information from other pages, and it seems to only exist now because of grandfathering, I doubt the wiki would support creating this page and trying to codify the concept of "home stages" if someone tried doing it now. Another thing, even when this article was created all the way back in 2006, the very [https://www.ssbwiki.com/index.php?title=Home_stage&oldid=117659 first sentence of the first iteration] admits the concept of "home stages" is confusing.
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| Also, I'll state that something taking a lot of work is usually a bad argument to do or not do something on the wiki, but it doesn't even apply in this case, a bot can easily remove the home stage parameter and its messes from infoboxes. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[File: TyranitarMS.png ]] 15:33, June 13, 2023 (EDT)
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| :I hate the fact that Ultimate simultaneously keeps the concept of home stages (especially with the characters in the Fighters Passes being bundled together with a stage) and throws it out the window, lol. I think it's fair to delete it, because the only reason you could keep it outside of "you fight these other characters here exclusively in single-player mode" is to say "yea, this is the home turf of the characters from the series this stage comes from"...which could easily be observed by looking at the universe template at the bottom of the page. [[User:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: black;">'''Aidan'''</span>]] [[User talk:Aidanzapunk|<span style="color: grey;">'''the</span> <span style="color: white; text-shadow: 0 0 2px black;">Ace</span> <span style="color: purple;">Gamer'''</span>]] 15:42, June 13, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::I support the deletion. I agree with the above that the whole concept of this is just confusing and inconsistant, and in some cases just plain nonsensical: this whole thing is literally just slapping whatever character under the "home stage" parameter if they were fought there in whatever mode. Also "home stage" is an unofficial term and concept to begin with. Sure [[SW:OFFICIAL|we don't always have to follow official rules]], but that still doesn't mean we can make up whatever we want. And the lack of a boundary for what should and shouldn't count as a home stage, combined with the aforementioned inconcistancy of which stages the characters are fought in, only makes the whole concept more confusing than it needs to be. [[File:Ness EB Sprite.png|20px]] '''[[User:Ultimate Toad|<font color="blue">Ultimate Toad,</font>]] [[User talk:Ultimate Toad|<font color="gold">the Ness main.</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Ultimate Toad|<font color="red">(Fuzzy pickles!)</font>]]''' 21:42, June 13, 2023 (EDT)
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