Editing Forum:Project M coverage
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{{Forumheader|Proposals}}<!-- Please put your content under this line. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~ --> | {{Forumheader|Proposals}}<!-- Please put your content under this line. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~ --> | ||
{{Proposal | {{Proposal}} | ||
Here's the fact: Project M is becoming less and less relevant. The PMDT has disbanded, VGBC is no longer streaming it, and the [[Cashed Out| | Here's the fact: Project M is becoming less and less relevant. The PMDT has disbanded, VGBC is no longer streaming it, and the [[Cashed Out| | ||
last PM national]] was held on ''January 21st, 2017, over a month ago''. As PM tournaments become more scarce and our PM character articles fall more and more out of date, I think it is finally time to declare PM old news. That is why I propose that the PM character articles be removed. Two ways we can do this: | last PM national]] was held on ''January 21st, 2017, over a month ago''. As PM tournaments become more scarce and our PM character articles fall more and more out of date, I think it is finally time to declare PM old news. That is why I propose that the PM character articles be removed. Two ways we can do this: | ||
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==Support full deletion of PM character pages== | ==Support full deletion of PM character pages== | ||
#I think that we need to make ssbwiki more relevant to what is up to date. I think we need to do this for Project M and SSBB. This will drive more attention on what is currently going on, and people won't be adding random Brawl trivia rather than help add results for the recent Melee/Smash 4 SuperMajor tournament. How do you sign stuff... | #I think that we need to make ssbwiki more relevant to what is up to date. I think we need to do this for Project M and SSBB. This will drive more attention on what is currently going on, and people won't be adding random Brawl trivia rather than help add results for the recent Melee/Smash 4 SuperMajor tournament. How do you sign stuff... {{unsigned|LCS}} | ||
#:The only reason that this is an option for PM is because it's a mod of an official game. You want to delete character pages for Brawl, an official game in the series? That game had a 7 year run competitively, there's no way those are ever being deleted. Just because it isn't played much anymore doesn't mean they should just be thrown away. (I feel this way about PM as well.) Also, notability is not specifically a matter of "it's no longer relevant": notability is a matter of "it WAS relevant at one point". [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 17:25, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #:The only reason that this is an option for PM is because it's a mod of an official game. You want to delete character pages for Brawl, an official game in the series? That game had a 7 year run competitively, there's no way those are ever being deleted. Just because it isn't played much anymore doesn't mean they should just be thrown away. (I feel this way about PM as well.) Also, notability is not specifically a matter of "it's no longer relevant": notability is a matter of "it WAS relevant at one point". [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 17:25, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#::I just think that ssbwiki should be more about getting current info. If brawl at CEO Dreamland revives the franchise, then I think we should change nothing. We are all entitled to our own opinion, and I just think that is a very appropriate option right now. (I'm kind of offended | #::I just think that ssbwiki should be more about getting current info. If brawl at CEO Dreamland revives the franchise, then I think we should change nothing. We are all entitled to our own opinion, and I just think that is a very appropriate option right now. (I'm kind of offended {{unsigned|LCS}} | ||
#:::I don't get the logic behind deleting the character pages for ''Brawl'' just because they're not being played competitively as much anymore. I think that sets a very dangerous precedent for any other games that may or may not fall into obscurity in the future. ''Brawl'' pages aren't stopping people from editing ''Smash 4'' and ''Melee'' pages. Also, keep in mind that this is not strictly a wiki for the competitive scene: this is a wiki dedicated to the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 14:02, 5 March 2017 (EST) | #:::I don't get the logic behind deleting the character pages for ''Brawl'' just because they're not being played competitively as much anymore. I think that sets a very dangerous precedent for any other games that may or may not fall into obscurity in the future. ''Brawl'' pages aren't stopping people from editing ''Smash 4'' and ''Melee'' pages. Also, keep in mind that this is not strictly a wiki for the competitive scene: this is a wiki dedicated to the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 14:02, 5 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#::::Well, I just think that making ssbwiki more based on the competitive scene is what we should do. You don't have to agree with me, but I think this is what would be best for the wiki. Besides, I am the only person on this wiki who thinks this. It won't happen. | #::::Well, I just think that making ssbwiki more based on the competitive scene is what we should do. You don't have to agree with me, but I think this is what would be best for the wiki. Besides, I am the only person on this wiki who thinks this. It won't happen. {{unsigned|LCS}} | ||
#:::::If you think that this won't ever happen, why bother mentioning it? Bottom line, Brawl character pages will never be deleted. However, Project M, due to it not being official and the mod itself is losing popularity, we need to consider reducing it's significance. Also, please sign your comments with <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. [[User:Dots|<font color="red">'''D'''</font><font color="green">'''o'''</font><font color="blue">'''t'''</font><font color="purple">'''s'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Dots|talk]]) [[File:Mega Man X SNES sprite.png|19px]] The Gordon Freeman 13:29, 7 March 2017 (EST) | #:::::If you think that this won't ever happen, why bother mentioning it? Bottom line, Brawl character pages will never be deleted. However, Project M, due to it not being official and the mod itself is losing popularity, we need to consider reducing it's significance. Also, please sign your comments with <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. [[User:Dots|<font color="red">'''D'''</font><font color="green">'''o'''</font><font color="blue">'''t'''</font><font color="purple">'''s'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Dots|talk]]) [[File:Mega Man X SNES sprite.png|19px]] The Gordon Freeman 13:29, 7 March 2017 (EST) | ||
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#I'd say that a condensed version with all of the major details (similar to the [[Brawl-/Character changes|Brawl Minus]] character page) seems like a good solution. It's also worth noting that, unlike the Brawl- page, a PM page can't be outdated at this point. [[User:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Crimson;">'''Bacon'''</span>]][[User talk:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Maroon;">'''Master'''</span>]][[File:BaconMasterSig.png|16px|link=]] 18:01, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #I'd say that a condensed version with all of the major details (similar to the [[Brawl-/Character changes|Brawl Minus]] character page) seems like a good solution. It's also worth noting that, unlike the Brawl- page, a PM page can't be outdated at this point. [[User:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Crimson;">'''Bacon'''</span>]][[User talk:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Maroon;">'''Master'''</span>]][[File:BaconMasterSig.png|16px|link=]] 18:01, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#I never liked Project M. A single bit. Characters are so broken and Meleefied. I never got why it got to become a competitive game. While I like some of the skin mods to characters, this game lacks a lot of originality. However, seeing it does have a competitive base, I think that this should actually be the only factible solution. At least condense it in a full article. And hey, the articles are also badly written. We should really get a Project M dev to help us with the changelogs if the changes to characters are going to stay. --[[File:BeepYouSignature.png|40px]] [[User talk:BeepYou|<font color="Black">'''(talk)'''</font>]] 18:36, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #I never liked Project M. A single bit. Characters are so broken and Meleefied. I never got why it got to become a competitive game. While I like some of the skin mods to characters, this game lacks a lot of originality. However, seeing it does have a competitive base, I think that this should actually be the only factible solution. At least condense it in a full article. And hey, the articles are also badly written. We should really get a Project M dev to help us with the changelogs if the changes to characters are going to stay. --[[File:BeepYouSignature.png|40px]] [[User talk:BeepYou|<font color="Black">'''(talk)'''</font>]] 18:36, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
==Oppose any deletion== | ==Oppose any deletion== | ||
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#We worked hard to create the character pages and each of them are fully detailed. Also PM still has appearances in local tournaments. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is a never lover boy 12:09, 10 March 2017 (EST) | #We worked hard to create the character pages and each of them are fully detailed. Also PM still has appearances in local tournaments. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is a never lover boy 12:09, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#Are the pages taking up too many kilobytes of data on the servers? I don't understand any reason to delete or condense these pages aside from people who don't play the game having distaste for it, which is ridiculous. If anything, I think an effort should be made to expand the pages, adding more information about character specific techniques and matchups. It's incredibly difficult to learn anything in this game because it lacks good resources; everything I've learned has been through word of mouth at tournaments (which still frequently happen and are well attended). To burn down one of the few resources left is as senseless as it is pointless. 1:09, 11 March 2017 (EST) | #Are the pages taking up too many kilobytes of data on the servers? I don't understand any reason to delete or condense these pages aside from people who don't play the game having distaste for it, which is ridiculous. If anything, I think an effort should be made to expand the pages, adding more information about character specific techniques and matchups. It's incredibly difficult to learn anything in this game because it lacks good resources; everything I've learned has been through word of mouth at tournaments (which still frequently happen and are well attended). To burn down one of the few resources left is as senseless as it is pointless. 1:09, 11 March 2017 (EST) | ||
==Neutral== | ==Neutral== | ||
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::Besides that, you are changing the subject. I was talking about the old discussion, and how it was agreed that PM was allowed to be mentioned. I am not saying, let's go and put "In Project M" sections on everything, I am not saying "Let's add it to our nav and infobox templates" and I am certainly not saying it should be included in the sidebar with the official games, but I really do think that pretending that it doesn't exist outside of competitive articles and PM specific ones is really stupid. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 22:45, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ::Besides that, you are changing the subject. I was talking about the old discussion, and how it was agreed that PM was allowed to be mentioned. I am not saying, let's go and put "In Project M" sections on everything, I am not saying "Let's add it to our nav and infobox templates" and I am certainly not saying it should be included in the sidebar with the official games, but I really do think that pretending that it doesn't exist outside of competitive articles and PM specific ones is really stupid. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 22:45, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ||
:I deeply apologise for any trouble I may have caused. In a way I kind of started the whole Reddit thing. I know I have no say in this since I'm neither an admin or a rollbacker, but still. [[File:RagnarokSignature.png|22px|link=]] [[User:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: red;">'''Ragnarok320, The Toa of Fire''']]</span> [[User talk:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: black;">'''(talk)'''</span>]] 09:27, 11 March 2017 (EST) | :I deeply apologise for any trouble I may have caused. In a way I kind of started the whole Reddit thing. I know I have no say in this since I'm neither an admin or a rollbacker, but still. [[File:RagnarokSignature.png|22px|link=]] [[User:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: red;">'''Ragnarok320, The Toa of Fire''']]</span> [[User talk:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: black;">'''(talk)'''</span>]] 09:27, 11 March 2017 (EST) | ||
::@Ragnarok320 Reddit didn't do much here, they mostly rekindled the pages so that people are editing them now. @Miles 3 new reddit users voted against, all the others were older users (OT, Toast, Kenniky, KoRo, Baz, Psuedo-Dino, SabotuerGG, and Zeldastarfox) are all older users so you're point there is incorrect. Ragna, don't feel bad for yourself, and Miles, please look between Reddit users and Veteran users | ::@Ragnarok320 Reddit didn't do much here, they mostly rekindled the pages so that people are editing them now. @Miles 3 new reddit users voted against, all the others were older users (OT, Toast, Kenniky, KoRo, Baz, Psuedo-Dino, SabotuerGG, and Zeldastarfox) are all older users so you're point there is incorrect. Ragna, don't feel bad for yourself, and Miles, please look between Reddit users and Veteran users [[File:PoultrysigSSB4.png|20x50px]][[User:Poultry|<font color="red">'''Poultry'''</font>]][[File:PoultrysigSSBM.png|20x50px]]''([[User talk:Poultry#top|<font color="blue">talk</font>]])'' the God-Slayer 13:15, 11 March 2017 (EST) | ||