Lucina (SSBU): Difference between revisions

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Lucina is far less similar to Marth than Daisy is to Peach. Can Memoryman3 please stop shitting on her just because Daisy is less unique?
(Lucina is far less similar to Marth than Daisy is to Peach. Can Memoryman3 please stop shitting on her just because Daisy is less unique?)
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With the exception of the third method, Lucina must then be defeated on [[Arena Ferox]].
With the exception of the third method, Lucina must then be defeated on [[Arena Ferox]].


==Differences from Marth==
==Attributes==
As in ''SSB4'', the primary difference between Lucina and Marth is that Lucina lacks a tipper, meaning that her sword attacks deal equal damage throughout her blade. She is less effective at spacing than Marth, but in return can rack up damage more consistently. As such, Lucina is more versatile and aggressive, but also less rewarding. Theoretically, Marth deals more overall damage when played optimally and can kill earlier, but Lucina can deal consistent damage and kill more reliably without worrying about precise spacing. Lucina was also slightly recloned from her previous appearance in ''SSB4'', as she is no longer shorter than Marth, her up tilt will now move her forward slightly, and she no longer keeps her momentum on her neutral attack and up tilt. Despite losing these somewhat negligible differences, she keeps one other difference from ''SSB4'': her up tilt has a unique sweetspot based on how late into the swing the opponent is hit. This ensures that she can rack up damage more easily with her up tilt as long as she is facing away from her opponent.


As an [[Echo Fighter]] of Marth, Lucina shares all of his moves and has identical physical attributes. Whilst all of her attacks have identical framedata to Marth's, the main difference is that Lucina's Parallel Falchion deals the same amount of damage throughout all parts of the sword for most moves (with exceptions such as Dolphin Slash), equal to the weighted average of Marth's sweet and sourspotted attacks. Theoretically, Marth deals more overall damage, and can kill earlier due to the high power of his tippers, but Lucina's attacks are decently more powerful than Marth's sourspot attacks. However, the same strategies can be applied to both characters.  
Overall, whether a person wants to use Lucina or Marth is based on their playstyle. Marth relies on spacing, more defensive play, and early KOs. Lucina can be played more aggressively, and relies on her more effective combos to increase the damage enough so she can KO the opponent. Marth can be more rewarding if used right, but Lucina's consistent damage and knockback helps her in certain matchups. Even without a tipper, Lucina is still extremely effective at spacing, though nowhere near to the extent of Marth. She also shares Marth's strong [[juggling]] and [[edgeguarding]] capabilities. As such, she is considered to be one of the most versatile characters in the game, even when compared to Marth.


Despite her strengths and versatility, Lucina is not without flaws, most of them shared with Marth. As a solely sword-based character, her otherwise excellent [[neutral game]] suffers from her lack of a projectile, and she can struggle against projectile-heavy characters and playstyles. This ties in with her vulnerability once she loses the neutral game, as despite having a below-average weight and only average falling speed, Lucina is susceptible to combos, and her tall hurtbox provides an easy target. Dolphin Slash is her only reliable combo-breaker, but as it leaves her helpless, it can inadvertently put her in an even worse position. Also, while Counter can be used defensively, it leaves Lucina extremely vulnerable to punishment should it whiff. Lucina also has little defense against juggling, as her aerials are ineffective at relieving pressure; though her attacks have quick startup, many of them come with high ending lag, and also suffer from short hitbox durations.
Like with Marth, Lucina's weak throws are another notable weakness. Except for her up throw, they have low knockback scaling, preventing them from KOing at realistic percents, while up throw can only KO starting at 160% if Lucina has no rage. Her throw game is poor as well; aside from having a fairly fast pummel, Lucina's throws deal low damage and have high base knockback, making them poor for combos and damage-racking outside of very low percents, such as aerials at 0%. However, it should be noted that the high base knockback of her throws allow Lucina to take advantage of her good edgeguarding capability, especially at the edge.
While Lucina and Marth have largely identical attacks, mobility attributes and frame data, the lack of a tipper spreads across Lucina's entire moveset, making her one of the more unique Echo Fighters alongside her father {{SSBU|Chrom}} and {{SSBU|Ken}}. As such, these three characters are expected to have their own spots on the [[tier list]], and are expected to be permitted to be used alongside their base fighters in [[Squad Strike]]. Lucina has obtained excellent results and representation early in the ''Ultimate'' metagame, especially compared to Marth.
===Differences from {{SSBU|Marth}}===
===Aesthetics===
===Aesthetics===
*{{change|As with all other Echo Fighters, Lucina has different taunts and victory animations.}}
*{{change|As with all other Echo Fighters, Lucina has different taunts and victory animations.}}
*{{change|Lucina's on-screen appearance is slightly different from that of Marth, as she removes her mask. She also has a different No Contest animation as well.}}
*{{change|Unlike all other Echo Fighters, Lucina's [[Screen KO]] animation is different from Marth's.}}
*{{change|Lucina's [[victory theme]] is different from that of Marth, being a remix of the ''Fire Emblem Awakening'' song "Id (Purpose)."}}
*{{change|Lucina's [[victory theme]] is different from that of Marth, being a remix of the ''Fire Emblem Awakening'' song "Id (Purpose)."}}
*{{change|Lucina's on-screen appearance is slightly different from that of Marth, as she removes her mask. She also has a different No Contest animation as well.}}
*{{change|Lucina's [[Screen KO]] animation is different from Marth's.}}
*{{change|Lucina's shield breaker animation is different. She steps back and charges at a more exaggerated fashion.}}
**{{change|Whilst Kirby received a new animation when using Marth's Shield Breaker, Lucina retains her one from Smash 4}}
*{{change|Lucina assumes a different stance for her Counter animation}}
*{{change|Lucina's sword trails are completely opaque, while Marth's are only opaque at the tip of his blade.}}
*{{change|Lucina's sword trails are completely opaque, while Marth's are only opaque at the tip of his blade.}}
*{{change|Lucina has a few different facial expressions when performing certain actions, such as carrying a crate.}}


===Attributes===
===Attributes===
*{{change|Due to the Parallel Falchion lacking a [[tipper]] like Falchion, its entire blade deals equal damage and knockback, equal to the weighted average of Marth's sweet- and sourspotted attacks. This change applies to most, but not all attacks.}}
*{{change|Due to the Parallel Falchion lacking a [[tipper]] like Falchion, its entire blade deals equal damage and knockback on most attacks, equal to the weighted average of Marth's sweet- and sourspotted attacks.}}
**{{buff|Moves that move Lucina forward, such as [[Dancing Blade]], are more effective than Marth's variants due to the forward movement counteracting with the tipper.}}
**{{buff|Lucina can rack up damage more easily than Marth, as most of Marth's Falchion is composed of his sourspot.}}
**{{nerf|Lucina's damage and knockback are significantly lower than Marth's sweetspots, hindering her KO potential, and making her unable to space as well as Marth.}}
*{{change|Aside from her neutral attack, the rest of Lucina's moveset lacks [[hitlag]] modifiers.}}


==Attributes==
===Ground attacks===
As with Marth, Lucina is considered to be emblematic of swordfighters; her playstyle revolves around spacing, utilizing her exceptional range and reliable moves to. She is in the middle ground of [[weight|lightweight and middleweight]], boasting high overall mobility, notably sporting the fastest [[walk|walking speed]] in the game (tied with her base fighter, {{SSBU|Marth}}), a fast [[dash|dashing speed]], average [[air speed]], above average [[air acceleration]], moderate [[falling speed]], and low [[gravity]].
*{{change|The second hit of Lucina's neutral attack has less knockback scaling (45 → 75), making it slightly less effective at spacing, but slightly more effective for combos.}}
*{{buff|Lucina's [[up tilt]] (named "Anti-air Slash" in the in-game tips) has a unique timing-based sweetspot. On the later half of the slash, the attack does more damage while also having weaker knockback. The combination of less knockback and more damage allows her up tilt to rack more damage than Marth's as long as she is facing away from her opponent.}}
**{{nerf|Since the timing-based sweetspot deals less knockback, it cannot be used to reliably KO as much as Marth's variant.}}
*{{change|Down tilt has different particle effects.}}


Lucina's playstyle revolves around effective [[spacing]], due to the long range of her sword, and overall safety when far. Her frame data is overall above-average, with many attacks having low startup and wide range all-around, allowing her to space efficiently. Because of this, Lucina aims to fight a step away from danger, without leaving herself too open to punishment.
===Special moves===
 
*[[Shield Breaker]]:
Like Marth, Lucina's [[neutral game]] is unique by scaling with percent, as set-ups and combos become more rewarding at higher percentages. She also benefits from being one of the few characters in the game who can outright KO through playing her neutral and spacing game; essentially, while Lucina's neutral reward is not as rewarding or damaging as other characters including Marth's, Lucina has the ability to win neutral exchanges with relative ease and safety, especially with her balanced blade which grants consistent set-ups and follow-ups.
**{{buff|Lucina's Shield Breaker's animation is different. She leans farther back during its start-up; trembles more exaggeratedly while rearing her arm back; and takes a step forward during its thrust. This marginally improves Lucina's horizontal recovery potential compared to Marth's, due to her hitbox being slightly wider when using this move. This change is also reflected when {{SSBU|Kirby}} copies this.}}
 
*[[Dolphin Slash]]:
Lucina's advantage state as a whole is quite strong. Her combination of good speed and range give her  excellent [[juggling]] capabilities, as she can easily dash to where a falling opponent might land and catch them with her wide attacks, especially her up tilt and up aerial. Her disjointed hitboxes also allow him to challenge opponent's falling attacks safely. Because of this, Lucina has an easy time keeping opponents in the air and racking up damage. These traits also grant her strong [[edgeguarding]] abilities, as her wide aerials can cover enemy movement well, and certain moves such as her back aerial can outright KO offstage opponents thanks to their power and reliability. Moreover, her general floatiness also allows her to recover back to the stage after edgeguarding attempts fairly safely. Certain moves such as her forward smash have respectable kill potential, killing as early as 80% onstage no matter which part of the sword she strikes.
**{{change|Lucina may shout when using Dolphin Slash, whereas Marth does not vocalize when using it.}}
 
*[[Counter]]:
Lucina's special moveset provides interesting options as well; her neutral special, [[Shield Breaker]], deals very high shield damage, even when uncharged, and is useful for covering rolls and landings. [[Dancing Blade]] is a four-hit combo that can be used to punish sidesteps and rolls, as well as effectively rack up damage. [[Dolphin Slash]] has quick startup, provides slight intangibility during its startup frames, is relatively strong when it first comes out, and has high knockback scaling. These attributes make it an excellent out of shield option and combo-breaker. It is also Lucina's primary method of recovery, as its speed can make it difficult to intercept, and it can stage spike reckless edgeguarders. Lastly, [[Counter]] provides her with the capability to reverse attacks with 1.2× the damage, KOing if the attack was strong enough; it can also be used against opponents with easily predictable recoveries.
**{{change|Lucina's Counter's stance is different. She also has different quotes when she counterattacks, saying either "My turn!" or "You're mine!"}}
 
*[[Critical Hit]]:
Despite her strengths, Lucina has some notable weaknesses. Due to Lucina possessing a sword, her moves generally have greater ending lag than characters who fight with physical attacks. Though her attacks have quick startup, many of them come with high ending lag, and also suffer from short hitbox durations, leaving him open for counterattacks during certain situations. As a solely sword-based character, Lucina's neutral also suffers from a lack of a projectile, and she can struggle against projectile heavy characters and playstyles. This ties in with her vulnerability once he loses the neutral: despite having below average weight and only average falling speed, Lucina is susceptible to combos, and her tall hurtbox provides an easy target. Dolphin Slash is her only reliable combo-breaker, but as it leaves her helpless, it can inadvertently put her in an even worse position. Also, while Counter can be used defensively, it leaves Lucina extremely vulnerable to punishment should it whiff. Lucina also has little defense against juggling, as her aerials are ineffective at relieving such pressure.
**{{change|Lucina utters "Time to change fate!" when using her Final Smash, whereas Marth merely grunts.}}
 
Lucina additionally has a fairly weak grab game. Except for up throw, they have low knockback scaling, preventing them from KOing at realistic percents, while up throw can only KO starting at 170%, if Lucina has no rage. Her other throws are somewhat lackluster; aside from having a fairly fast pummel, Lucina's throws deal low damage and have high base knockback, making them poor for combos and damage-racking outside of down throw leading into an aerial until high percents. However, it should be noted that the high base knockback of her throws allow Lucina to take advantage of her good edgeguarding capability, especially at the edge.
 
Lucina herself is somewhat vulnerable to edgeguarding, though she has options for mix-ups with her recovery. Dolphin Slash is her only reliable vertical recovery option, and while it is still a threat to edgeguarders due to its speed and high stage spike ability, its path is linear and its distance fixed, making it fairly predictable. Additionally since this move grants little horizontal distance, Lucina is vulnerable to semi-spikes. While Shield Breaker can aid her horizontal recovery, it covers little distance without charging. Lucina is also heavily reliant on her double jump for mix-ups in her recovery, and is in significant danger if offstage without it.
 
Overall, Lucina is an effective character that has many benefits; high overall mobility, long range, reliable and safe attacks, and above-average frame data. However, Lucina has a relatively low amount of attack power overall compared to other sword users, her close range game is not ideal due to relatively high endlag on her moves.  At her purest, Lucina is most rewarding for players with good fundamentals, with many playstyles applicable to her due to her flaws being easily worked around with careful play.


==Changes from ''[[Super Smash Bros. 4]]''==
==Changes from ''[[Super Smash Bros. 4]]''==
Much like with {{SSBU|Marth}}, Lucina highly benefits from the universal changes in ''SSBU'', particularly in terms of aerials and tilts. In addition, the new engine is also a benefit to Lucina's balanced blade, as the faster pace of the game allows her greater close-combat capabilities to be an advantage in certain situations. Unlike most clones, Lucina became slightly more similar to Marth, though a majority of her reclonings were neglible (such as her being slightly shorter, or a few moves not stopping her momentum).
Much like with {{SSBU|Marth}}, Lucina highly benefits from the universal changes in ''SSBU'', particularly in terms of aerials and tilts. In addition, the new engine is also a benefit to Lucina's balanced blade, to an extent far greater than Marth's more polarized blade, as the faster pace of the game allows her greater close-combat capabilities to be an advantage in certain situations. Unlike most clones, Lucina became slightly more similar to Marth, though a majority of her reclonings were neglible (such as her being slightly shorter, or a few moves not stopping her momentum).
   
   
===Aesthetics===
===Aesthetics===
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|bairname=About Face
|bairname=About Face
|bairdmg={{ShortHopDmgSSBU|11.875}}
|bairdmg={{ShortHopDmgSSBU|11.875}}
|bairdesc=An upward crescent slash behind her in an inward swipe. Has the interesting property of turning Lucina around, changing the direction she is facing. Similar use to her forward aerial, although with more knockback and a smaller hitbox. Safe on shield when spaced low to the ground. Lucina's strongest aerial, KOing middleweights at the edge around 110%.
|bairdesc=An upward crescent slash behind her in an inward swipe. Has the interesting property of turning Lucina around, changing the direction she is facing. Similar use to her forward aerial, although with more knockback and a smaller hitbox. Safe on shield when spaced low to the ground. Rather strong given its speed, KOing middleweights at the edge around 110%.
|uairname= 
|uairname= 
|uairdmg={{ShortHopDmgSSBU|11.4}}
|uairdmg={{ShortHopDmgSSBU|11.4}}
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|dthrowname= 
|dthrowname= 
|dthrowdmg=4%
|dthrowdmg=4%
|dthrowdesc=Throws opponent to the ground with one arm, bouncing them upwards. At low to mid percents, its angle and high base knockback allow it to follow up into an up back aerial depending on [[DI]], or only an up aerial at higher percents. Despite having low knockback growth, it still loses its combo potential around roughly 80%-90%.
|dthrowdesc=Throws opponent to the ground with one arm, bouncing them upwards. Her primary throw for follow-ups due to its low base knockback, allowing her to follow up with an up or back aerial at low percentages. However, it quickly loses combo potential due to its high knockback growth, sending opponents too high after medium percentages.
|floorfname= 
|floorfname= 
|floorfdmg=7%
|floorfdmg=7%
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<!--If you are planning to add a player you consider to be notable, please provide tournament results in some shape or form in the edit summary (be it a link to a results thread or bracket of placing high in a tournament of other notable players or a video of them beating a notable player). Winning tournaments without notable players present is generally not enough to warrant a spot.-->
<!--If you are planning to add a player you consider to be notable, please provide tournament results in some shape or form in the edit summary (be it a link to a results thread or bracket of placing high in a tournament of other notable players or a video of them beating a notable player). Winning tournaments without notable players present is generally not enough to warrant a spot.-->
*{{Sm|Etsuji|Japan}} - The best Lucina player in Japan. Placed 17th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP}}, 7th at {{Trn|Umebura SP 2}} and 13th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 2}}.
*{{Sm|Etsuji|Japan}} - The best Lucina player in Japan. Placed 17th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP}}, 7th at {{Trn|Umebura SP 2}} and 13th at {{Trn|Sumabato SP 2}}.
*{{Sm|K9sbruce|USA}} - Uses Lucina in tangent with Wolf. Placed 17th at {{Trn|SoCal Chronicles}} using only Lucina.
*{{Sm|k9sbruce|USA}} - Placed 17th at {{Trn|SoCal Chronicles}}.
*{{Sm|Kobe|USA}} - Placed 13th at {{Trn|Smash Conference United}}.
*{{Sm|Kobe|USA}} - Placed 13th at {{Trn|Smash Conference United}}.
*{{Sm|Mew2King|USA}} - Placed 25th at {{Trn|Smash Conference United}}.
*{{Sm|Mew2King|USA}} - Placed 25th at {{Trn|Smash Conference United}}.
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