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Forum:Improvements to the "In competitive play" section of character articles: Difference between revisions
Forum:Improvements to the "In competitive play" section of character articles (edit)
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So then, any comments before I start adding this stuff in my revision of each character article, as well as suggestions for additional things we could add to improve the competitive information in our character articles? <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:27, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | So then, any comments before I start adding this stuff in my revision of each character article, as well as suggestions for additional things we could add to improve the competitive information in our character articles? <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:27, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
:In my eyes, the tournament succes does not rely on the characters, but the players. In that case, it should not go in a character article.-- | :In my eyes, the tournament succes does not rely on the characters, but the players. In that case, it should not go in a character article.--'''''[[User:PSIWolf|<font color="red">PSIWolf</font>]]''''' <sup>[[User talk:PSIWolf|<font color="black">The one</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/PSIWolf|<font color="black">and only!</font>]]</sup> 11:38, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
::1. It's player and character, no matter how much you want to be ignorant about it. 2. You offered no explanation how any of this potential information is not relevant to the character. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:49, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ::1. It's player and character, no matter how much you want to be ignorant about it. 2. You offered no explanation how any of this potential information is not relevant to the character. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:49, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
:::1. How good the character does depends on how the player uses him or her. For example, you have Meta Knight, but someone who can't play Brawl uses him. That won't turn out well. | :::1. How good the character does depends on how the player uses him or her. For example, you have Meta Knight, but someone who can't play Brawl uses him. That won't turn out well. | ||
:::2. Because it is relevant to the Smasher.-- | :::2. Because it is relevant to the Smasher.--'''''[[User:PSIWolf|<font color="red">PSIWolf</font>]]''''' <sup>[[User talk:PSIWolf|<font color="black">The one</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/PSIWolf|<font color="black">and only!</font>]]</sup> 11:51, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
::::1. If it was all player with the character completely irrelevant, why is Meta Knight so dominant and no low/bottom tier characters ever winning? Stop being so ignorant, and read [[User:Semicolon/Treatise on the Existence of Tiers|this]]. | ::::1. If it was all player with the character completely irrelevant, why is Meta Knight so dominant and no low/bottom tier characters ever winning? Stop being so ignorant, and read [[User:Semicolon/Treatise on the Existence of Tiers|this]]. | ||
::::2. That doesn't explain anything about how the character is not relevant to what I'm proposing. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:55, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ::::2. That doesn't explain anything about how the character is not relevant to what I'm proposing. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 11:55, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
:::::You cannot call me ignorant right away if you asked for comments yourself. But if you want me to GTFO, then you could've just said so.-- | :::::You cannot call me ignorant right away if you asked for comments yourself. But if you want me to GTFO, then you could've just said so.--'''''[[User:PSIWolf|<font color="red">PSIWolf</font>]]''''' <sup>[[User talk:PSIWolf|<font color="black">The one</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/PSIWolf|<font color="black">and only!</font>]]</sup> 11:57, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
::::::Don't want to be called out for your ignorance? Don't make ignorant comments. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 12:01, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ::::::Don't want to be called out for your ignorance? Don't make ignorant comments. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 12:01, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
:::::::Ignorance? I did not say anything you proposed was not true. Does not seem like ignorance. If you do'nt want comments, don't ask for them. I'm sure that, if someone else made a comment, even if it had the same content as mine, you wouldn't have called that one ignorant.-- | :::::::Ignorance? I did not say anything you proposed was not true. Does not seem like ignorance. If you do'nt want comments, don't ask for them. I'm sure that, if someone else made a comment, even if it had the same content as mine, you wouldn't have called that one ignorant.--'''''[[User:PSIWolf|<font color="red">PSIWolf</font>]]''''' <sup>[[User talk:PSIWolf|<font color="black">The one</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/PSIWolf|<font color="black">and only!</font>]]</sup> 12:04, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
::::::::You objected me adding this information for "tournament succes does not rely on the characters, but the players", under the delusion that character does not play a part at all. That's ignorance. | ::::::::You objected me adding this information for "tournament succes does not rely on the characters, but the players", under the delusion that character does not play a part at all. That's ignorance. | ||
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I support this. It's important to cover the aspects of a character in theory as well as in effect. <sup>—[[User:Smiddle|Smiddle]]</sup> my sig is not fancy 12:38, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | I '''support''' this. It's important to cover the aspects of a character in theory as well as in effect. <sup>—[[User:Smiddle|Smiddle]]</sup> my sig is not fancy 12:38, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
Oh, I support By the way, appologies for offence. [[User:ScoreCounter|ScoreCounter]] ([[User talk:ScoreCounter|talk]]) 12:47, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | Oh, I support By the way, appologies for offence. [[User:ScoreCounter|ScoreCounter]] ([[User talk:ScoreCounter|talk]]) 12:47, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
'''Support''', what Smiddle said.-- | '''Support''', what Smiddle said.--'''''[[User:PSIWolf|<font color="red">PSIWolf</font>]]''''' <sup>[[User talk:PSIWolf|<font color="black">The one</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/PSIWolf|<font color="black">and only!</font>]]</sup> 13:04, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
Also, having only the matchups of the character on the "In competitive play" (except Meta Knight) on their character pages had me change the section title of "In competitive play" into '"Matchups". Should I change it back or we could make another section of the previous title? [[User:Dots|Dots]] [[User talk:Dots|The]] [[Special:Contributions/Dots|Asian]] [[File:NintenNESsprite.png|19px]] 13:16, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | Also, having only the matchups of the character on the "In competitive play" (except Meta Knight) on their character pages had me change the section title of "In competitive play" into '"Matchups". Should I change it back or we could make another section of the previous title? [[User:Dots|Dots]] [[User talk:Dots|The]] [[Special:Contributions/Dots|Asian]] [[File:NintenNESsprite.png|19px]] 13:16, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
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I '''support''' this. However, something just came to mind about our scope on competitive play: there is very little coverage of doubles matches. While for most characters, this is not very significant, I'm thinking we could have a small section in some character's pages about how they do in variations in competitive play (in other words how they are impacted by additional stages being legal, in doubles matches, etc). Basically this would be an "other" section. [[User:Mr. Anon|<font color="grey">'''Mr. '''</font><font color="midnightblue">'''Anon'''</font>]][[File:Anon.png|23px|link=Special:Random]][[User talk:Mr. Anon|''<span style="color: black;">talk</span>'']] 22:44, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | I '''support''' this. However, something just came to mind about our scope on competitive play: there is very little coverage of doubles matches. While for most characters, this is not very significant, I'm thinking we could have a small section in some character's pages about how they do in variations in competitive play (in other words how they are impacted by additional stages being legal, in doubles matches, etc). Basically this would be an "other" section. [[User:Mr. Anon|<font color="grey">'''Mr. '''</font><font color="midnightblue">'''Anon'''</font>]][[File:Anon.png|23px|link=Special:Random]][[User talk:Mr. Anon|''<span style="color: black;">talk</span>'']] 22:44, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
:Just as an example, I've heard Mr. Game and Watch and Ness perform differently in teams, due to their down specials that benefit them in doubles matches. Other competetive info like this could go in its own section. [[User:Mr. Anon|<font color="grey">'''Mr. '''</font><font color="midnightblue">'''Anon'''</font>]][[File:Anon.png|23px|link=Special:Random]][[User talk:Mr. Anon|''<span style="color: black;">talk</span>'']] 22:46, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | :Just as an example, I've heard Mr. Game and Watch and Ness perform differently in teams, due to their down specials that benefit them in doubles matches. Other competetive info like this could go in its own section. [[User:Mr. Anon|<font color="grey">'''Mr. '''</font><font color="midnightblue">'''Anon'''</font>]][[File:Anon.png|23px|link=Special:Random]][[User talk:Mr. Anon|''<span style="color: black;">talk</span>'']] 22:46, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | ||
::Such information can be included in their attributes section, as well as the "impact in tournament play" section if the character has significantly greater presence in doubles (such as the aforementioned Game & Watch). <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 22:55, 21 August 2012 (EDT) | |||
'''Support''': In addition to all that's been said, I'd also like to suggest we state recent tournament placement statistics. This can be either it's own subsection or included in the "Tournament Success" or "Impact on Tournament" sections. We can get these statistics from bracket data from big tournaments. --<span style="background-color:#6d84e1;border:3px solid silver">[[User:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:silver">'''Brian'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:black">Don't try me!</span>]]</sup>[[File:Falco.gif|link=|27px]]</span> 22:33, 26 August 2012 (EDT) | |||
:I'm not sure what you mean. The "tournament success" section is already going to list tournament statistics of the characters' success. Also elaborate on what you mean with "bracket data". <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 15:08, 27 August 2012 (EDT) | |||
::Oh sorry about that, I meant to suggest that we add how well characters tend to place. For example, Foxes and Marths usually place in the range of 25 to 9 when it comes to big tournaments. There can be some exceptions for example Javi placing 4th at Apex, and Taj placing 3rd at Genesis 2. 1 small caveat though. I said bracket data because that's where we could get this type of information from.--<span style="background-color:#6d84e1;border:3px solid silver">[[User:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:silver">'''Brian'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:1337 B33FC4K3|<span style="color:black">Don't try me!</span>]]</sup>[[File:Falco.gif|link=|27px]]</span> 16:09, 27 August 2012 (EDT) | |||
:::Sounds nice, but I find it to be a bit general, and unlike money data for Brawl, there doesn't already exist a nice source with all the info. But if you can gather up all the data, I could take a look at it and see what we can implement. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 00:05, 28 August 2012 (EDT) | |||