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Forum:Project M coverage: Difference between revisions
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{{Forumheader|Proposals}}<!-- Please put your content under this line. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~ --> | {{Forumheader|Proposals}}<!-- Please put your content under this line. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~ --> | ||
{{Proposal}} | {{Proposal|failed}} | ||
Here's the fact: Project M is becoming less and less relevant. The PMDT has disbanded, VGBC is no longer streaming it, and the [[Cashed Out| | Here's the fact: Project M is becoming less and less relevant. The PMDT has disbanded, VGBC is no longer streaming it, and the [[Cashed Out| | ||
last PM national]] was held on ''January 21st, 2017, over a month ago''. As PM tournaments become more scarce and our PM character articles fall more and more out of date, I think it is finally time to declare PM old news. That is why I propose that the PM character articles be removed. Two ways we can do this: | last PM national]] was held on ''January 21st, 2017, over a month ago''. As PM tournaments become more scarce and our PM character articles fall more and more out of date, I think it is finally time to declare PM old news. That is why I propose that the PM character articles be removed. Two ways we can do this: | ||
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==Support full deletion of PM character pages== | ==Support full deletion of PM character pages== | ||
#I think that we need to make ssbwiki more relevant to what is up to date. I think we need to do this for Project M and SSBB. This will drive more attention on what is currently going on, and people won't be adding random Brawl trivia rather than help add results for the recent Melee/Smash 4 SuperMajor tournament. How do you sign stuff... | #I think that we need to make ssbwiki more relevant to what is up to date. I think we need to do this for Project M and SSBB. This will drive more attention on what is currently going on, and people won't be adding random Brawl trivia rather than help add results for the recent Melee/Smash 4 SuperMajor tournament. How do you sign stuff... <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:LCS|LCS]] ([[User talk:LCS|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/LCS|contribs]]) {{{2}}}</small> | ||
#:The only reason that this is an option for PM is because it's a mod of an official game. You want to delete character pages for Brawl, an official game in the series? That game had a 7 year run competitively, there's no way those are ever being deleted. Just because it isn't played much anymore doesn't mean they should just be thrown away. (I feel this way about PM as well.) Also, notability is not specifically a matter of "it's no longer relevant": notability is a matter of "it WAS relevant at one point". [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 17:25, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #:The only reason that this is an option for PM is because it's a mod of an official game. You want to delete character pages for Brawl, an official game in the series? That game had a 7 year run competitively, there's no way those are ever being deleted. Just because it isn't played much anymore doesn't mean they should just be thrown away. (I feel this way about PM as well.) Also, notability is not specifically a matter of "it's no longer relevant": notability is a matter of "it WAS relevant at one point". [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 17:25, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#::I just think that ssbwiki should be more about getting current info. If brawl at CEO Dreamland revives the franchise, then I think we should change nothing. We are all entitled to our own opinion, and I just think that is a very appropriate option right now. (I'm kind of offended | #::I just think that ssbwiki should be more about getting current info. If brawl at CEO Dreamland revives the franchise, then I think we should change nothing. We are all entitled to our own opinion, and I just think that is a very appropriate option right now. (I'm kind of offended <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:LCS|LCS]] ([[User talk:LCS|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/LCS|contribs]]) {{{2}}}</small> | ||
#:::I don't get the logic behind deleting the character pages for ''Brawl'' just because they're not being played competitively as much anymore. I think that sets a very dangerous precedent for any other games that may or may not fall into obscurity in the future. ''Brawl'' pages aren't stopping people from editing ''Smash 4'' and ''Melee'' pages. Also, keep in mind that this is not strictly a wiki for the competitive scene: this is a wiki dedicated to the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 14:02, 5 March 2017 (EST) | #:::I don't get the logic behind deleting the character pages for ''Brawl'' just because they're not being played competitively as much anymore. I think that sets a very dangerous precedent for any other games that may or may not fall into obscurity in the future. ''Brawl'' pages aren't stopping people from editing ''Smash 4'' and ''Melee'' pages. Also, keep in mind that this is not strictly a wiki for the competitive scene: this is a wiki dedicated to the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series. [[User:PokemonMasterJamal3|PokemonMasterJamal3]] ([[User talk:PokemonMasterJamal3|talk]]) 14:02, 5 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#::::Well, I just think that making ssbwiki more based on the competitive scene is what we should do. You don't have to agree with me, but I think this is what would be best for the wiki. Besides, I am the only person on this wiki who thinks this. It won't happen. | #::::Well, I just think that making ssbwiki more based on the competitive scene is what we should do. You don't have to agree with me, but I think this is what would be best for the wiki. Besides, I am the only person on this wiki who thinks this. It won't happen. <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:LCS|LCS]] ([[User talk:LCS|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/LCS|contribs]]) {{{2}}}</small> | ||
#:::::If you think that this won't ever happen, why bother mentioning it? Bottom line, Brawl character pages will never be deleted. However, Project M, due to it not being official and the mod itself is losing popularity, we need to consider reducing it's significance. Also, please sign your comments with <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. [[User:Dots|<font color="red">'''D'''</font><font color="green">'''o'''</font><font color="blue">'''t'''</font><font color="purple">'''s'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Dots|talk]]) [[File:Mega Man X SNES sprite.png|19px]] The Gordon Freeman 13:29, 7 March 2017 (EST) | #:::::If you think that this won't ever happen, why bother mentioning it? Bottom line, Brawl character pages will never be deleted. However, Project M, due to it not being official and the mod itself is losing popularity, we need to consider reducing it's significance. Also, please sign your comments with <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. [[User:Dots|<font color="red">'''D'''</font><font color="green">'''o'''</font><font color="blue">'''t'''</font><font color="purple">'''s'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Dots|talk]]) [[File:Mega Man X SNES sprite.png|19px]] The Gordon Freeman 13:29, 7 March 2017 (EST) | ||
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#I'd say that a condensed version with all of the major details (similar to the [[Brawl-/Character changes|Brawl Minus]] character page) seems like a good solution. It's also worth noting that, unlike the Brawl- page, a PM page can't be outdated at this point. [[User:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Crimson;">'''Bacon'''</span>]][[User talk:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Maroon;">'''Master'''</span>]][[File:BaconMasterSig.png|16px|link=]] 18:01, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #I'd say that a condensed version with all of the major details (similar to the [[Brawl-/Character changes|Brawl Minus]] character page) seems like a good solution. It's also worth noting that, unlike the Brawl- page, a PM page can't be outdated at this point. [[User:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Crimson;">'''Bacon'''</span>]][[User talk:BaconMaster|<span style="color: Maroon;">'''Master'''</span>]][[File:BaconMasterSig.png|16px|link=]] 18:01, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#I never liked Project M. A single bit. Characters are so broken and Meleefied. I never got why it got to become a competitive game. While I like some of the skin mods to characters, this game lacks a lot of originality. However, seeing it does have a competitive base, I think that this should actually be the only factible solution. At least condense it in a full article. And hey, the articles are also badly written. We should really get a Project M dev to help us with the changelogs if the changes to characters are going to stay. --[[File:BeepYouSignature.png|40px]] [[User talk:BeepYou|<font color="Black">'''(talk)'''</font>]] 18:36, 4 March 2017 (EST) | #I never liked Project M. A single bit. Characters are so broken and Meleefied. I never got why it got to become a competitive game. While I like some of the skin mods to characters, this game lacks a lot of originality. However, seeing it does have a competitive base, I think that this should actually be the only factible solution. At least condense it in a full article. And hey, the articles are also badly written. We should really get a Project M dev to help us with the changelogs if the changes to characters are going to stay. --[[File:BeepYouSignature.png|40px]] [[User talk:BeepYou|<font color="Black">'''(talk)'''</font>]] 18:36, 4 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#It's just a mod, and a shitty one, as well. Who can we thank for Brawl's loss of a competitive scene? That's right, Project M! Plus, players unfamiliar with Project M or the series might go here to learn more about Smash, and think some mod is a real Smash game because of how bloated PM is with its unnecessary individual character pages. We can't have that, can we? [[User:ViciousViridian|ViciousViridian]] ([[User talk:ViciousViridian|talk]]) 01:08, 13 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
#:Brawl's loss of popularity was due to its unpopular mechanics, slower and unfriendly gameplay, and the imbalance of its character roster. Not to be biased again but, while Project M might be a backlash response to vanilla Brawl's gameplay, it was honestly never the cause of its downfall. [[User:Dots|<font color="red">'''D'''</font><font color="green">'''o'''</font><font color="blue">'''t'''</font><font color="purple">'''s'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Dots|talk]]) [[File:Mega Man X SNES sprite.png|19px]] The NES 12:41, 13 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
==Oppose any deletion== | ==Oppose any deletion== | ||
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#There is literally no reason for any deletion whatsoever. Completely regardless of whether it's relevant or not - which shouldn't even be a factor - I see absolutely no reason that the pages can't just stay there and what harm they could potentially do by staying there. I think the only result that would come out of deletion is a notable loss in site traffic and revenue. If you're a moderator who supports deletion of ANY, you should seriously consider stepping down. [[User:Infinite901|Infinite901]] ([[User talk:Infinite901|talk]]) | #There is literally no reason for any deletion whatsoever. Completely regardless of whether it's relevant or not - which shouldn't even be a factor - I see absolutely no reason that the pages can't just stay there and what harm they could potentially do by staying there. I think the only result that would come out of deletion is a notable loss in site traffic and revenue. If you're a moderator who supports deletion of ANY, you should seriously consider stepping down. [[User:Infinite901|Infinite901]] ([[User talk:Infinite901|talk]]) | ||
#We worked hard to create the character pages and each of them are fully detailed. Also PM still has appearances in local tournaments. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is a never lover boy 12:09, 10 March 2017 (EST) | #We worked hard to create the character pages and each of them are fully detailed. Also PM still has appearances in local tournaments. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is a never lover boy 12:09, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ||
#Are the pages taking up too many kilobytes of data on the servers? I don't understand any reason to delete or condense these pages aside from people who don't play the game having distaste for it, which is ridiculous. If anything, I think an effort should be made to expand the pages, adding more information about character specific techniques and matchups. It's incredibly difficult to learn anything in this game because it lacks good resources; everything I've learned has been through word of mouth at tournaments (which still frequently happen and are well attended). To burn down one of the few resources left is as senseless as it is pointless. 1:09, 11 March 2017 (EST) | |||
#PM still has it's tournaments. What good will deletion do? <span style="font-family:Corbel; font-size:12pt">[[User:Smash Master|<span style="color:darkblue">'''Smash''']] [[User talk:Smash Master|<span style="color:darkgreen">'''Master'''</span>]]</span></span> 14:04, 11 March 2017 (EST) | |||
#PM is a mod that people like even more than the original game. The only cause of all of this is Nintendo shutting down the project. We can't let the best mod ever created die. We can't forget it saved us from the death of a smash competitive scene. And there's still one. And it's still fun to play casually. This deletion would be everything but good. <b>[[User:Anto99|<font color="teal">Anto99</font>]] [[User talk:Anto99|<font color="purple">(talk)</font>]]</b> 08:41, 12 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
#Ohh so we're supporting creating PM & deleted some of our edits to this? No thanks. That's waste of our efforts to what we are doing. It is notable for saving smash competitive scene from controversial Brawl. Not liking PM is not a good reason. Smash wiki is a source of the game and competitive play NOT anti competitive & mod bias. [[User:Luigi540|Luigi540]] ([[User talk:Luigi540|talk]]) 09:48, 13 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
==Neutral== | ==Neutral== | ||
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:::::Except the exact opposite was agreed on in the poll I linked to. You don't get to override consensus. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 21:59, 10 March 2017 (EST) | :::::Except the exact opposite was agreed on in the poll I linked to. You don't get to override consensus. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 21:59, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ||
::::::Except that's not how it was implemented into policy, as seen in [[SW:NOT]]. That wasn't policy even after the discussion 3+ years ago, and basing policy on 3-year-old discussion isn't a good choice regardless. I'd also argue that this poll hardly qualifies as consensus since we got kind of "witch-hunted" by a reddit thread and many of the accounts voting against deletion are IPs or new users who seem to have had no investment in the issue until then. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Verdana;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 22:05, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ::::::Except that's not how it was implemented into policy, as seen in [[SW:NOT]]. That wasn't policy even after the discussion 3+ years ago, and basing policy on 3-year-old discussion isn't a good choice regardless. I'd also argue that this poll hardly qualifies as consensus since we got kind of "witch-hunted" by a reddit thread and many of the accounts voting against deletion are IPs or new users who seem to have had no investment in the issue until then. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Verdana;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 22:05, 10 March 2017 (EST) | ||
:::::::So you're saying that the decision (by consensus) wasn't correctly implemented into the policy and it shouldn't be because...it's old? Ooook. Also these "non-invested users" you are talking about include Toomai, Scr7, Dots, JamesHeart, Brian, AC, and Toast. Idk if there's more who are significant, I wasn't around then (also I would have voted the same way as them if I was). <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 22:11, 10 March 2017 (EST) | |||
::::::::"This poll" in my previous post refers to this page, not the old one. I refuse to let a bandwagon come into this site and change policy in ways that are ultimately destructive and set a terrible precedent. We've repeatedly taken down fan content that had no business being on the site (remember our [[machinima]] page? or our Smash Flash page that was deleted before the move?). PM content getting in was barely acceptable before; expanding it is out of the question and contrary to a decade of precedent. We cover community content that is relevant to the main games, not fan-made content other than basic descriptions. Adding permission to throw PM-related notes all over the mainspace reverses that policy in a disastrous and extremely-hard-to-undo fashion, and is far more than it deserves in this context. If the only justification for it is "it's played a lot in tournaments", then leave it to the tournament listings and an absolute bare minimum beyond that (i.e. the character pages at most). Don't litter the mainspace with it. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Verdana;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 22:20, 10 March 2017 (EST) | |||
<small>reset</small> If that's your stance on it, then you need to create a new poll, rather than ignoring consensus on the old one. We are a consensus-based wiki, and to ignore consensus for no other reason than precedence, I think, is a worse break of precedence. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 22:25, 10 March 2017 (EST) | |||
:I had been planning on making a new poll on the subject ([[User:Miles of SmashWiki/PM condensing|remember this?]]) but you preempted me and laid out the discussion differently than I would have. You've left me with few options, so I apologize if I'm a bit frustrated by the situation. I would prefer to work more cooperatively on this, but I'm not willing to let "consensus" be hijacked by [https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/5yiaob/ssbwiki_editors_discuss_deleting_or_condensing/ a thread] full of people insulting the wiki and its userbase. Before the thread was posted, [https://www.ssbwiki.com/index.php?title=Forum:Project_M_coverage&oldid=940598 it was 12-6] in favor of condensing. It sets bad precedent to let a raid re-write consensus so blatantly, too. [[User:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="dodgerblue"><span style="font-family:Verdana;">'''Miles''']] <font color="silver">([[User talk:Miles of SmashWiki|<font color="silver">talk]])</font></font></span></font> 22:30, 10 March 2017 (EST) | |||
::I am more than happy to work cooperatively with you in laying out a new coverage model with you. Obviously we wouldn't be revisiting this discussion again...but I think it's high time we modernize and make perfectly clear what we do and don't cover. | |||
::Regarding reddit, if you read between the personal attacks and stupid comments, a few of them actually have decent points, such as [https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/5yiaob/ssbwiki_editors_discuss_deleting_or_condensing/der0kkc/ this one] and [https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/5yiaob/ssbwiki_editors_discuss_deleting_or_condensing/deqc88k/ this one] (strike the "let's remove SSB and SSBB talk at the end). While most of that reddit thread is garbage, we should not disregard the legitimate arguments presented there. | |||
::Besides that, you are changing the subject. I was talking about the old discussion, and how it was agreed that PM was allowed to be mentioned. I am not saying, let's go and put "In Project M" sections on everything, I am not saying "Let's add it to our nav and infobox templates" and I am certainly not saying it should be included in the sidebar with the official games, but I really do think that pretending that it doesn't exist outside of competitive articles and PM specific ones is really stupid. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 22:45, 10 March 2017 (EST) | |||
:I deeply apologise for any trouble I may have caused. In a way I kind of started the whole Reddit thing. I know I have no say in this since I'm neither an admin or a rollbacker, but still. [[File:RagnarokSignature.png|22px|link=]] [[User:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: red;">'''Ragnarok320, The Toa of Fire''']]</span> [[User talk:Ragnarok320|<span style="color: black;">'''(talk)'''</span>]] 09:27, 11 March 2017 (EST) | |||
::@Ragnarok320 Reddit didn't do much here, they mostly rekindled the pages so that people are editing them now. @Miles 3 new reddit users voted against, all the others were older users (OT, Toast, Kenniky, KoRo, Baz, Psuedo-Dino, SabotuerGG, and Zeldastarfox) are all older users so you're point there is incorrect. Ragna, don't feel bad for yourself, and Miles, please look between Reddit users and Veteran users EDIT: You are valuable page, you do have just as much as a say as i do, or SK does, your input is important (unless it is vandalism) [[File:PoultrysigSSB4.png|20x50px]][[User:Poultry|<font color="red">'''Poultry'''</font>]][[File:PoultrysigSSBM.png|20x50px]]''([[User talk:Poultry#top|<font color="blue">talk</font>]])'' the God-Slayer 13:15, 11 March 2017 (EST) | |||
So I see Miles still hasn't changed from his AllisBrawl moderator days and still would rather alienate the greater Smash community from this wiki in order to get his way. You do realise Miles that this wiki was made and is maintained by the Smash community, for the Smash community? The opinions of smashers from the Smash reddit are just as valuable as the opinions of wiki editors in what information is valuable to the Smash community. Trying to keep the wiki in its own bubble only shuns potential editors, and degrades the wiki's content; did you forget how badly this wiki was at attracting new editors during the Brawl days, when this wiki was treated as a complete joke by the greater Smash community? Sure the efforts of a few very diligent users managed to keep the content from degrading too much during those days, but the wiki nonetheless felt tremendous trouble in remaining up-to-date and filling its pages to the brim with quality information. Just one of the aforementioned diligent users not being there could have been enough to slink this wiki to full irrecoverable irrelevancy. I wouldn't say the wiki still has fully recovered from those dark ages; people still just post their information on reddit, Twitter, Facebook, Youtube, or Smashboards, leaving valuable information scattered and hard to find, instead of posting it on this wiki where it will remain easily visible and findable. | |||
Then when it comes to whinging comments like: | |||
"''I refuse to let a bandwagon come into this site and change policy in ways that are ultimately destructive and set a terrible precedent.''" | |||
"''I'd also argue that this poll hardly qualifies as consensus since we got kind of "witch-hunted" by a reddit thread and many of the accounts voting against deletion are IPs or new users who seem to have had no investment in the issue until then.''" | |||
"''I would prefer to work more cooperatively on this, but I'm not willing to let "consensus" be hijacked by a thread full of people insulting the wiki and its userbase. Before the thread was posted, it was 12-6 in favor of condensing. It sets bad precedent to let a raid re-write consensus so blatantly, too.''" | |||
You just come off as someone who is upset because they didn't get their way, especially when you don't even attempt to offer any refute to the opposition's reasons nor make it any less apparent that you don't have an anti-PM bias going on. Not to mention the anti-community vibe that continues to come off you that I have railed against for who knows how long now. I'm still left wondering why a guy who appears so anti-community, makes no apparent effort to be actively involved with the greater Smash community, nor even makes any effort towards just socializing with the wiki editors, still spends all this time actively modding the wiki for 9 years; do you just really enjoy the dullness of administration, or is this just all a power thing for you? Hell, how much do you even play any Smash nowadays? <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 06:19, 12 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
:...While I don't really think that the amount of Smash played has anything to do with administrating this wiki, I do have to agree that your ignoring of the smash community is rather...alarming. You've been blinded by the trollish hate on the reddit thread and because of it, you choose to disregard any true argument against this proposal. | |||
:Once this is finished (can't be long now) I intend to open a new poll on the mentioning of PM on other articles, since you apparently won't. If you want to collaborate with me, fine, give me a shout on my talk, but I won't allow you to ignore consensus a second time. <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 13:09, 12 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
::"''...While I don't really think that the amount of Smash played has anything to do with administrating this wiki''" | |||
::It's very much relevant for a myriad of reasons. For one thing, it becomes a big question of one motive's for continuing to administrate a wiki that covers a game series they don't really play much in depth anymore; any reasonable admin will attest that the duties of administration are not glamorous themselves and are a time-consuming duty. Then if one doesn't play the games actively indepth, their familiarity with the content material comes under question, especially when Smash is a multiplayer game with a heavy competitive influence, that sees a continuous cycle of new information coming in and old information becoming out-of-date. And then when it's a multiplayer game with a heavy socialisation aspect even if you don't play it competitively, how can one be intuned with the game's community and its desires when they're not much of a player, especially when they have remained so asocial? | |||
::Now one could be a capable admin still without really playing the game, but mostly towards handling the user-side and noncontent-related policy side. Shadowcrest/Emmett was an admin/bureaucrat who exemplified this, who helped the wiki tremendously on user-side issues, but even then problems arose from his lack of interest in the games and his lack of familiarity with the community. He faded away to his own accord when he lost interest in the wiki's content material however, before those problems could end up hurting the wiki on the content side. But Miles as admin has always been content-focused and never delve much into the user-side, while always having been recognised as poor in that area, so that possible mitigation doesn't apply here for this lack of ingame experience and community awareness. <span style="font-family:Edwardian Script ITC; font-size:12pt">[[User:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Omega</span>]] [[User talk:Omega Tyrant|<span style="color:forestgreen">Tyrant</span>]]</span> [[Image: TyranitarMS.png ]] 01:10, 13 March 2017 (EDT) | |||
Final comment: It seems this suggestion was made primarily based on a misunderstanding of the current state of affairs, so since there is so much dissent about it, there's no way it's going through. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] [[Image:Toomai.png|20px|link=User:Toomai/Bin|???]] The Honcho 17:48, 13 March 2017 (EDT) | |||