Talk:Tier list/Archive 1: Difference between revisions

I've checked the [[Tier list]] page and there's still no Brawl tier list. Fox should be top tier again, followed by Falco then Lucario. -- [[User:FoxMcCloud251|FoxMcCloud251]] 20:06, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Hopefully never. Tiers are for queers. And no matter what poor excuse people use to defend it, that's the truth. <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:76.208.30.106|76.208.30.106]] ([[User talk:76.208.30.106|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/76.208.30.106|contribs]]) 05:43, 23 April 2008 (UTC)</small>

Obviously the tier list for Brawl will change signifigantly. All of the upper tier characters have received big hits, Peach getting hit the worst. By contrast, some of the lower tiers got better. Bowser will be at least middle tier now, Pikachu has one of the best FS's, Game and Watch is heavier (a bit), etc. Something to the effect that the current list will drastically change would be a nice addition, with also the FACT(It is, no denying) that MetaKnight, Pit, and Wolf will  be contenders for the top (With Dedede, and Lucario following). I have no account, so, no sig...[[User:71.170.166.146|71.170.166.146]] 05:01, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

I doubt FS's will be allowed, given that the Smash Ball is an item. As for who should be in the top tier, I'm leaning towards Meta Knight and Pit as being the best, but that's just my opinion.

:# It doesn't have to be npov; there's no policy ''on this wiki'' stating that is necessary. Nor would it fall under such rules, as it quite clearly states who determines it and why.

:::According to [http://www.nintendo.com/whatsnew/detail/1u0FthaPxTSSeJelWm4Jt8TI0VJlTt5j  this], over 7 million copies of Melee have been sold.  Each copy is played by at least one person, so there are millions of Melee players.  Clearly the number of people who have ever been to an "official tournament" (note the use of quote marks) is a decimal percentage of that.  Most of those 7 million probably haven't even heard of SmashBoards or the tournament subculture.  To them, the "high tournament standards" are one possible permutation out of billions of others.  Nintendo does not favour this permutation out of any others.  The issue with the smasher articles was not that they were self promotion, but that they were of little interest to the majority of readers and editors of Smashwiki.  That is the same issue with this - it is written only for an extermely small audience.

::::"It is common sense." + NPOV - I did not argue that point. I argued that you have no policy, nothing behind which the community has decided they agree with, to back you up. Do I agree with you? Certainly! Can you argue the point? Nope!

:::::"Appeal to the masses".  I would not consider less than 2% "the masses" or "the majority".  In fact, I would consider it an [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Npov#Undue_weight  extremely small minority].  And you admit that the article's bias towards the pro-tiers/tournament players is the whole point of the article.  An article of that nature does not belong in the main namespace.  People would still have the "choice" as to how they use the information if it was moved to the Smasher namespace.  Wikia is not here to advertise the SmashBoards community or these tournaments. [[User:Dtm142|Dtm142]] 01:20, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

::::::Again, you have not addressed any of my points. If you would like to do so, feel free. As for "choice", people won't end up stumbling onto it if it's in the smasher namespace. Again, ''people stumbling into this article is not a bad thing'', and is how wikis work. You had a point when the articles were on smashers, especially those which no-one had heard about nor cared about, but your point falters here. People know what this is. Again you bring up "NPOV", which I will again refer you to the 2nd to last and the last paragraphs of my previous dissertation. Feel free to actually address my points.

Seriously, are all Internet users obsessed with the word "noob" or what? Anyway, despite your "noob" fetish, it's pretty obvious that you're trying to make me feel uncomfortable as a new user. Well guess what? No one intimidates me! I will continue to work here for as long as I can, and no one is going to shake me from that! And FYI, everyone's opinion matters here on SmashWiki, even newbies. I've been with the Smash series since the original on the N64, so I think I know a thing or two about how Smash works. Also, it's perfectly natural for a middle tier character to win a tournament. The Snake user was obviously very skilled. Tiers just show how good a certain character's metagame fares against others, and in my opinion, Snake's doesn't fare as well as some others. I know you probably won't change your tier list, but I honestly believe that mine was better made. Also, I don't have Ice Climbers on my list twice, so what do you have to say about that? - [[User:GalaxiaD|GalaxiaD]] 06:10, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

== Tiers on character profiles for Brawl? ==

:I just never understood tiers in general. I won't say they "don't exist" but they seem to be entirely based on personal preference more than actual statistics. If Brawl is ever to have a tier list, there will have to be a large amount of official tournaments with well known professionals. Also I agree that tiers really have no bearing to most smashers. Tier lists are simply a function of popularity and learning curve. For example, Olimar may take a bit of training to master compared to, say, Mario, but by no means is one inherently stronger or better than the other. At least, not enough to make him or her "broken" or "cheap". And granted, some matchups may seem unbalanced (Ganondorf vs Samus, perhaps...) it's more of a rock-paper-scissors dynamic. No single character is weak to a large number of other characters. For each weakness, each character has strengths.- [[User:Gargomon251|Gargomon251]] 01:45, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

I'm stepping in before this escalates. This discussion is '''''over'''''. '''[[User:Silverdragon706|FyreNWater]]''' -  <small>([[User talk:Silverdragon706|Talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Silverdragon706|Contributions]] )</small> 08:18, 7 May 2008 (UTC)