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Talk:Lucina (SSB4): Difference between revisions
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Trivia point about the website is not true: [http://i.imgur.com/NW7zljk.jpg] <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:84.26.240.80|84.26.240.80]] ([[User talk:84.26.240.80|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/84.26.240.80|contribs]]) 10:06, July 14, | Trivia point about the website is not true: [http://i.imgur.com/NW7zljk.jpg] <small>—Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:84.26.240.80|84.26.240.80]] ([[User talk:84.26.240.80|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/84.26.240.80|contribs]]) 10:06, July 14, 2014 (CDT)</small> | ||
:The browser version of the site gave Lucina a small slot however. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is made in America 11:18, 14 July 2014 (EDT) | :The browser version of the site gave Lucina a small slot however. [[:User:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|ZeldaStarfoxfan2164]] ([[User talk:ZeldaStarfoxfan2164|talk]]) is made in America 11:18, 14 July 2014 (EDT) | ||
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I understand this is a pretty explosive page as it is, but I just want to point out that, in today's Miiverse Post, Sakurai said that Lucina's 'physical abilities' are identical to Marth's, but didn't say anything about her moveset (aside from the sweetspot stuff). I ''would'' say that he's talking about Lucina's physics being the same as Marth's, but I can't quite be sure. Either way, he didn't outright say that Lucina has the exact same moveset, and we didn't see her entire moveset in her trailer, so I think that we should change the thing that says her moveset is identical to Marth's. Maybe we could have it say that they are clones to an extent that we're unsure of as of yet? [[User:Nymbare|<span style="color:#00BFFF">Nymbare</span>]] [[User talk:Nymbare|<span style="color:#00BFFF">and his talk</span>]] 09:54, 15 July 2014 (EDT) | I understand this is a pretty explosive page as it is, but I just want to point out that, in today's Miiverse Post, Sakurai said that Lucina's 'physical abilities' are identical to Marth's, but didn't say anything about her moveset (aside from the sweetspot stuff). I ''would'' say that he's talking about Lucina's physics being the same as Marth's, but I can't quite be sure. Either way, he didn't outright say that Lucina has the exact same moveset, and we didn't see her entire moveset in her trailer, so I think that we should change the thing that says her moveset is identical to Marth's. Maybe we could have it say that they are clones to an extent that we're unsure of as of yet? [[User:Nymbare|<span style="color:#00BFFF">Nymbare</span>]] [[User talk:Nymbare|<span style="color:#00BFFF">and his talk</span>]] 09:54, 15 July 2014 (EDT) | ||
Its 2019 now we already know [[User:Lucina-is-better-than-marth|Lucina-is-better-than-marth]] ([[User talk:Lucina-is-better-than-marth|talk]]) 22:28, November 5, 2019 (EST) | |||
== Lag == | == Lag == | ||
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Would it be worth noting in her Trivia that Lucina's alternate colors appear to be based on the color schemes of other Awakening females? Specifically (from left to right): Nowi, Cherche, Cordelia, Tiki, Lissa, Tharja, and Sumia. [[Special:Contributions/75.168.6.209|75.168.6.209]] 12:24, 20 July 2015 (EDT) | Would it be worth noting in her Trivia that Lucina's alternate colors appear to be based on the color schemes of other Awakening females? Specifically (from left to right): Nowi, Cherche, Cordelia, Tiki, Lissa, Tharja, and Sumia. [[Special:Contributions/75.168.6.209|75.168.6.209]] 12:24, 20 July 2015 (EDT) | ||
Note on the Trivia itself, which can be seen on the edit page: | |||
<--Do not add trivia regarding Lucina's alternate colors. It is already covered on the Alternate Costumes page.--> | |||
[[User:Archrelico|Archrelico]] ([[User talk:Archrelico|talk]]) 14:02, 20 July 2015 (EDT) | |||
== Since there's an impendent edit war... == | |||
108.14.98.64, or should I say Chliu... Let me ask you real quick. How are down smash and Shield Breaker better than Marth's, when his versions can KO 40% earlier when tipped? How do Lucina's forward air and back air combo better when Marth's based aerials have lower knockback? How is Lucina's jab better when it fails to connect 30% of the time when Marth's almost always does AND gets the tip with the second hit? How does Lucina have an easier time KOing when there are high-level players such as {{Sm|AirVault}} who send their opponents to oblivion at 50% with a tipper? | |||
Note that I am not being aggressive about this, I just want to discuss it. Although I'm only doing it because otherwise I'd be violating [[SW:1RV|this]]... If you have paid attention to my last edit summaries, you would have seen I am not only a dedicated Lucina main, I've sadly watched her fail miserably as well. So before undoing your edit yet again, I will wait as much as you need to respond. [[User:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Gold">'''Drill Blaster'''</span> <span style="color:LightBlue">'''Mark'''</span> <span style="color:Crimson">'''2'''</span>]] ''[[User talk:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Grey">(talk)</span>]]'' 10:55, 12 November 2015 (EST) | |||
Lucina's down smash is better simply because marth's rarely tippers, her shield breaker will also on average do more damage and knock back. One question I have you is that if you think Lucina is that bad, why don't you main Marth. I am currently trying to cater to both of our needs by mentioning her disadvantages as well. The article skimmed over her strengths. Her fair and bair string into themselves better because marth's tippers does too much knock back and untippered | |||
Not enough. I never said she killed earlier I said that she has an easier time killing at higher percents, because untippered Marth won't kill most mid weights off the side of the stage at 90% with an untippered f smash. This update happened a while ago, but their jabs connect better, and pretty much always at the base of the blade, which makes lucina's better. Just because someone hasn't had a lot of tourney rep doesn't make her trash and it certainly doesn't make her worse than Marth. [[User:Chliu|Chliu]] ([[User talk:Chliu|talk]]) 08:01, 13 November 2015 (EST) | |||
:Marth's based forward aerial and back aerial deal too little knockback to combo effectively? I've honestly never encountered it. Now for the rest... Saying that down smash is better because it's easier to tipper is like throwing Marth's variant out of the window. Shield Breaker dealing 1% less is a nuisance at best. Its knockback is indeed lacking when based (30/90 compared to 40/100) but you'll never see a high-level player getting hit by it when it has 22 frames of startup. KOing is easier for her at high percents, definitely, that was a complete misunderstanding of mine. Marth's jab tends to be tippered if the first hit is a bit further, and since it's still weaker, it's not hindered as much by rage or SDI. Lastly, the reason I main Lucina over Marth is because I'm bad at spacing. And she's my favourite female character by a large margin. As for tournament representation, I've never seen Lucina win one set, whereas AirVault placed 7th one time using only Marth. | |||
:One last thing: I am going to reword your edit. '''But.''' I won't change its meaning, and I won't remove it again. Also, [[Forum:Lucina vs. Marth|your new page]] is now a forum page. I, for one, still believe this is a very important matter. [[User:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Gold">'''Drill Blaster'''</span> <span style="color:LightBlue">'''Mark'''</span> <span style="color:Crimson">'''2'''</span>]] ''[[User talk:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Grey">(talk)</span>]]'' 09:43, 13 November 2015 (EST) | |||
Thank you for the apology,Ii would like to apologize as well. Lucina is my 2nd best character and seeing Marth bias (who I sometimes use) didn't make me happy. The reason I said her down smash was better is because Marth's rarely tippers. Trust me, it will almost never tipper. Shield Breaker, while Lucina's may not seem better, is slightly better not only due to increased damage and greater knockback, but also due to Marth's not tipping often. Shield Breaker IMO is one of their best moves, and it is landable, especially with b-reverses and with proper use. Thanks for not revising it, I tried to make it show she was around the same as Marth, which I believe. In toruneys, I have seen Lucina win sets, and it's not like Marth got 1st in anything either. I honestly think the Marth bias comes from the butthurt Melee fans who are angry that he was nerfed. I honestly think they need a buff (range, grab combo, aerial strings, better dair) and that Lucina should not be treated as "just a clone," a "beginner Marth for noobs," or "a worse version of Marth." Thank You [[User:Chliu|Chliu]] ([[User talk:Chliu|talk]]) 19:05, 13 November 2015 (EST) | |||
:You don't have to apologise, really. About down smash, I don't think anyone uses it, up smash is far better. Shield Breaker deals 25 shield damage, so evenif it doesn't KO, it still forces the opponent to stay away. "Butthurt Melee fans"... That about sums it up. Now they need lots of buffs, but we'll have to wait for now. Anyway, since this discussion is technically over, if you'd like any help, you can ask me anything. Unless I don't know, in which case go for more experienced users. [[User:Serpent King|For]] [[User:Nyargleblargle|example]]. [[User:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Gold">'''Drill Blaster'''</span> <span style="color:LightBlue">'''Mark'''</span> <span style="color:Crimson">'''2'''</span>]] ''[[User talk:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Grey">(talk)</span>]]'' 06:53, 14 November 2015 (EST) | |||
Differences from Marth looking good, nearly no bias, (darthrai edited so there was). [[User:Chliu|Chliu]] ([[User talk:Chliu|talk]]) 08:14, 15 November 2015 (EST) | |||
:We're making progress. Again, thanks for the help. [[User:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Gold">'''Drill Blaster'''</span> <span style="color:LightBlue">'''Mark'''</span> <span style="color:Crimson">'''2'''</span>]] ''[[User talk:Drill Blaster Mark 2|<span style="color:Grey">(talk)</span>]]'' 08:17, 15 November 2015 (EST) | |||
== Personal de-clone concepts == | |||
I'm not sure if this is the place to discuss it here, but it's been on my mind for a while since there's A LOT of people who seem to just hate the fact that Sakurai (save for Dr. Mario possibly) threw in clones of characters moveset wise once again. | |||
Here's the list of attacks that will be different for my personal version of Lucina in ''Smash'', with the Japanese names included JPN source wise: | |||
*Forward tilt: {{ja|スイングエッジ|Suingu Ejji}}, Swing Edge | |||
**{{change|Does a single-handed overhead swipe (with following/left arm bent across and raised a bit up) while leaning forward, almost akin to a one-legged crane-stance version of her forward smash (Dragon Killer).}} | |||
***{{change|Hits sooner up above her, but somewhat later compared to the original forward tilt. It still has roughly the same animation speed and recovery however.}} | |||
*Up tilt: {{ja|アンチエアスイング|Anchī Ea Suingu}}, Anti Air Swing | |||
**{{change|Swings upward and inward while standing upright, akin to a more vertical version of her neutral attack's second input (Combination Slash); ironically, the original up tilt was a near-vertical version of her neutral attack (Slash) and forward tilt (Hard Edge)}}. | |||
***{{change|Has more vertical range and range that hits behind her, but almost less horizontal range in front. Also has somewhat notable base knockback that makes it a solid combo tool, but the scaling is rather small to prevent it from being a cheap KO tool.}} | |||
*Neutral aerial: {{ja|ダブルスイング|Daburu Suingu}}, Double Swing | |||
**{{change|Slashes inward diagonally upward, then outward-upward both in a criss-cross. Has much better vertical range that allows her to control space in front of her, but lacks the turn around from her original neutral aerial's (Double Slash) second hit, thus it has no hitbox behind her directly other than a bit above on both hits (akin to the ending hitbox of Upper Swing, the original back aerial).}} | |||
*Down aerial: {{ja|ワイドムーン|Waido Muun}}, Wide Moon | |||
**{{change|Merely a different Japanese name for the ''Smash 4'' down aerial she keeps (while Marth retains the original Half Moon down aerial from ''Melee'' and ''Brawl''). Further sets both Lucina and Marth apart in not only she slashes with more grace, but she has her down aerial hit later in trade of not needing a sweetspot.}} | |||
*Back aerial: {{ja|ストレートスイング|Sutoreeto Suingu}}, Straight Swing | |||
**{{change|A backwards version of her forward aerial (Flag Cut), which hits sooner above, but hits later below her.}} | |||
Everything else stays the same (I might get flamed for posting something as stupid as this on this kind of talk page so let me know if I need to move this dumb post). --[[User:SneaselSawashiro|SneaselSawashiro]] ([[User talk:SneaselSawashiro|talk]]) 23:21, 28 July 2016 (EDT) | |||
:Yeah this belongs in a userpage, not on a talk page. This is talk abuse <span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva;font-size:12pt">'''[[User:Serpent King|<span style="color:#083;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #0b7">Serpent</span>]] [[File:SKSig.png|16px|link=]] [[User talk:Serpent King|<span style="color:#ed0;text-shadow:0px 0px 3px #fd0">King</span>]]'''</span> 23:23, 28 July 2016 (EDT) | |||
== Lucina's Japanese voice == | |||
In the Japanese version of the game, Lucina might yell out... [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45aKjG0BcFg something] if KO'd (about 6 seconds in). Does anyone know exactly what she's saying? [[User:Laniv|Laniv]] ([[User talk:Laniv|talk]]) 21:19, 29 September 2016 (EDT) | |||