Mario (SSBM): Difference between revisions

848 bytes added ,  5 years ago
(i used this move ingame and find that Mario can deal up to 14%)
Tag: Mobile edit
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When making the transition from ''Smash 64'' to ''Melee'', Mario got a mix of [[buff]]s and [[nerf]]s, but was neither strongly buffed or [[nerf]]ed. Mario is faster on the ground and he greatly benefits from the introduction of [[air dodging]] giving him a solid [[wavedash]] which makes his grounded movement much more solid overall. The speed of Mario's attacks has been considerably improved as most of his attacks have decreased ending lag and a decent amount of them have decreased startup lag as well. His edgeguarding has also considerably improved as his back aerial is considerably faster and his up aerial has been retooled to give it more edgeguarding potential. His new side special [[Cape]] also gives him a new powerful edgeguarding tool as well as an extra tool for recovering.
When making the transition from ''Smash 64'' to ''Melee'', Mario got a mix of [[buff]]s and [[nerf]]s, but was neither strongly buffed or [[nerf]]ed. Mario is faster on the ground and he greatly benefits from the introduction of [[air dodging]] giving him a solid [[wavedash]] which makes his grounded movement much more solid overall. The speed of Mario's attacks has been considerably improved as most of his attacks have decreased ending lag and a decent amount of them have decreased startup lag as well. His edgeguarding has also considerably improved as his back aerial is considerably faster and his up aerial has been retooled to give it more edgeguarding potential. His new side special [[Cape]] also gives him a new powerful edgeguarding tool as well as an extra tool for recovering.


As for his nerfs, Mario's damage output has been decreased and his KO power has been considerably decreased as many of his previous KO moves have been greatly weakened making it far more difficult for Mario to KO his opponents. His strongest KO moves (his forward and down smashes) while faster now have sourspots making them more difficult to use effectively. While Mario has a few new options to recover such as his cape and [[wall jump]], his recovery is overall worse (especially when relative to the cast) as his air speed is slower, he falls faster and his [[Super Jump Punch]] travels less distance making him easier to edgeguard.   
As for his nerfs, Mario's damage output has been decreased and his KO power has been considerably decreased as many of his previous KO moves have been greatly weakened making it far more difficult for Mario to KO his opponents. His strongest KO moves (his forward and down smashes) while faster now have sourspots making them more difficult to use effectively. While Mario has a few new options to recover such as his cape and [[wall jump]], his recovery is overall worse (especially when relative to the cast) as his air speed is slower, he falls faster, his fireballs are smaller making them a worse option to wall out opponents while recovering and his [[Super Jump Punch]] travels less distance making him easier to edgeguard.   


Overall, Mario is largely a much weaker character as his damage output is lower, his combo game is weaker in some aspects and many of his previous KO moves can no longer KO under 90-120%. In exchange, his attacks are much faster and his grounded movement has been improved especially due to the introduction of wavedashing. Mario remains in a similar spot on Melee's tier list and he overall struggles against higher tiered characters limiting his success in competitive play.  
Overall, Mario is largely a much weaker character as his damage output is lower, his combo game is weaker in some aspects and many of his previous KO moves can no longer KO under 90-120%. In exchange, his attacks are much faster and his grounded movement has been improved especially due to the introduction of wavedashing. Mario remains in a similar spot on Melee's tier list and he overall struggles against higher tiered characters limiting his success in competitive play.  
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===Ground attacks===
===Ground attacks===
*{{buff|The first and third hit of [[neutral attack]] deal more damage (2%/4% → 3%/5%).}}
*{{buff|The first and third hit of [[neutral attack]] deal more damage (2%/4% → 3%/5%).}}
*{{buff|Neutral attack's first and second hits now have [[set knockback]], allowing the third hit to connect reliably. All hits also have less ending lag (frame 18 → 16 (hit 1), frame 20 → 19 (hit 2), frame 26 → 23 (hit 3)).}}
*{{buff|Neutral attack's first and second hits now have [[set knockback]], allowing the third hit to connect more reliably. All hits also have less ending lag (frame 18 → 16 (hit 1), frame 20 → 19 (hit 2), frame 26 → 23 (hit 3)).}}
*{{change|Third hit of neutral attack can now [[clang]].}}
*{{change|Third hit of neutral attack can now [[clang]].}}
*{{nerf|The second hit has a shorter duration (frames 3-5 → 3-4) and the final hit has more startup lag (frame 3 → 5). Mario also can no longer cancel the first hit into [[grab]].}}
*{{nerf|The second hit has a shorter duration (frames 3-5 → 3-4) and the final hit has more startup lag (frame 3 → 5). Mario also can no longer cancel the first hit into [[grab]].}}
*{{nerf|Dash attack (12% (clean), 10% (late) → 9%/7%), all tilt attacks (12%/13%/14% → 8%/9%/10% (forward), 10% (up), 12% (down) → 8% (both)) and up (19% → 15%) and down smash (17% → 16% (front), 10%/12% (back)) all deal less damage.}}
*{{buff|Dash attack has less startup (frame 8 → 6) and ending lag (frame 41 → 38).}}
*{{buff|Dash attack has less startup (frame 8 → 6) and ending lag (frame 41 → 38).}}
*{{nerf|Dash attack deals lower knockback and its duration is one frame shorter.}}
*{{nerf|Dash attack deals less damage (12% (clean), 10% (late) → 9%/7%) and lower knockback (16/10 (base), 100 (scaling) → 70/50). Tts duration is one frame shorter.}}
*{{change|[[Dash attack]] now knocks opponents behind Mario.}}
*{{change|[[Dash attack]] now knocks opponents behind Mario (361° → 110°).}}
*{{buff|[[Forward tilt]] has less startup (frame 8 → 5) and ending lag (frame 43 → 33).}}
*{{buff|[[Forward tilt]] has less startup (frame 8 → 5) and ending lag (frame 43 → 33).}}
*{{nerf|Forward tilt has a much shorter duration (frames 8-17 → 5-7) and down angled forward tilt now has very weak set knockback at the Sakurai angle, making it extremely punishable at any percentage.}}
*{{nerf|Forward tilt deals less damage (12%/13%/14% → 8%/9%/10%) and has lower base knockback (10 → 6), has a much shorter duration (frames 8-17 → 5-7) and down angled forward tilt now has very weak set knockback (10 (base), 100 (scaling) → 1 (set), making it extremely punishable at any percentage.}}
*{{buff|[[Up tilt]] has less startup (frame 5 → 4) and ending lag (frame 42 → 30) and combos more reliably at lower percentages.}}
*{{buff|[[Up tilt]] has less startup (frame 5 → 4) and ending lag (frame 42 → 30) and combos more reliably at lower percentages.}}
*{{change|Up tilt deals less damage (10% → 8%) and knockback (0 (base), 150 (scaling) → 26/125). These changes hinder its KO potential but improve its juggling potential.}}
*{{nerf|Up tilt has a shorter duration (frames 5-16 → 4-12).}}
*{{nerf|Up tilt has a shorter duration (frames 5-16 → 4-12).}}
*{{buff|Down tilt has less ending lag (frame 40 → 35).}}
*{{buff|Down tilt has less ending lag (frame 40 → 35).}}
*{{change|[[Down tilt]] now hits opponents vertically instead of horizontally.}}
*{{change|[[Down tilt]] now hits opponents vertically instead of horizontally (361° → 80°).}}
*{{nerf|Down tilt has a shorter duration (frames 5-11 → 5-8).}}
*{{nerf|Down tilt deals less damage (12% → 8%) and knockback (0 (base), 100 (scaling) → 10/80). It also has a shorter duration (frames 5-11 → 5-8).}}
*{{buff|Mario has a new [[forward smash]] in which he extends his palm and produces small explosion from it. It has less startup (frame 16 → 12) and ending lag (frame 54 → 42), deals 1% more damage at the sweetspot, and has more [[range]].}}
*{{buff|Mario has a new [[forward smash]] in which he extends his palm and produces small explosion from it. It has less startup (frame 16 → 12) and ending lag (frame 54 → 42), deals 1% more damage at the sweetspot (18%/17%/16% → 19%/18%/17%), and has more [[range]].}}
*{{nerf|New forward smash has a sourspot that is much weaker. Its sweetspot deals slightly less knockback as well, despite dealing more damage (30 base/100 growth → 25/95).}}
*{{nerf|New forward smash has a sourspot that is much weaker dealing less damage (18%/17%/16% → 15%/11%/10%/13%) and knockback (30 (base), 100 (scaling) → 25/96). Its sweetspot deals slightly less knockback as well, despite dealing more damage (30 (base), 100 (scaling) → 25/95).}}
*{{buff|[[Up smash]] has a new animation; Mario now takes a massive step forward as he leans for the headbutt. This gives it a bit more horizontal range than before.}}
*{{buff|[[Up smash]] has a new animation; Mario now takes a massive step forward as he leans for the headbutt. This gives it a bit more horizontal range than before.}}
*{{buff|Up smash has significantly less ending lag (frame 60 → 40).}}
*{{buff|Up smash has significantly less ending lag (frame 60 → 40).}}
*{{nerf|Up smash is much weaker (26 (base)/120 (scaling) → 32/97) and deals less damage (19% → 15%), no longer being one of Mario's reliable KO moves and is no longer the strongest up smash (this title now belongs to {{SSBM|Pikachu}}). It also has slightly more start-up and a much shorter hitbox duration (7-15 → 9-11).}}
*{{nerf|Up smash is much weaker dealing less damage (19% → 15%) and knockback (26 (base)/120 (scaling) → 32/97) no longer being one of Mario's reliable KO moves and is no longer the strongest up smash (this title now belongs to {{SSBM|Pikachu}}). It also has slightly more startup lag with a much shorter hitbox duration (frames 7-15 → 9-11).}}
*{{buff|[[Down smash]] has less startup (frame 8 → 5) and ending lag (frame 45 → 38).}}
*{{buff|[[Down smash]] has less startup (frame 8 → 5) and ending lag (frame 45 → 38).}}
*{{nerf|Down smash deals less knockback (100 (scaling) → 75), When combined with its lower damage output, this greatly hinders its KO potential. The back hit is also drastically weaker than the front hit now.}}
*{{nerf|Down smash deals less damage (17% → 16% (front), 12%/10% (back)) and knockback (20 (base), 100 (scaling) → 40/75 (front), 35 (back)/75) greatly hindering its KO potential. The back hit is also drastically weaker than the front hit now.}}


===Aerial attacks===
===Aerial attacks===
*{{nerf|Forward, up and down aerials [[auto-cancel]] later (frame 26 → 28 (forward), frame 11 → 16 (up), frame 32 → 33 (down)). Mario can no longer auto-cancel neutral, forward or down aerials in a short hop which is hindered further by the weakening of [[L-canceling]].}}
*{{nerf|Forward, up and down aerials [[auto-cancel]] later (frame 26 → 43 (forward), frame 11 → 16 (up), frame 32 → 33 (down)). Mario can no longer auto-cancel neutral, forward or down aerials in a short hop which is hindered further by the weakening of [[L-canceling]].}}
*{{buff|[[Neutral aerial]] has much higher knockback scaling an has less ending lag (frame 50 → 46).}}
*{{buff|[[Neutral aerial]] has higher base knockback (15 (clean), 0 (late) → 20/15) and has less ending lag (frame 50 → 46).}}
*{{nerf|Neutral aerial has a shorter duration (frames 3-36 → 3-32) and deals less damage (14% (clean), 11% (late) → 12%/10%).}}
*{{nerf|Neutral aerial has a shorter duration (frames 3-36 → 3-32) and deals less damage (14% (clean), 11% (late) → 12%/10%).}}
*{{buff|New [[forward aerial]] is an extended downward punch in front of him. It is a [[meteor smash]] and lacks a sourspot.}}
*{{buff|New [[forward aerial]] is an extended downward punch in front of him. It is a [[meteor smash]] (361° → 280°) and lacks a sourspot.}}
*{{nerf|New forward aerial has more startup with a shorter duration (frames 11-26 → 18-22) and has more ending lag (frame 40 → 60). It is a less reliable [[edgeguarding]] move overall due to the introduction of meteor canceling. It also deals less damage (16% → 15%) and knockback (10 (base), 100 (scaling) → 30/70), and has less combo potential, now being one of the weakest forward aerials, and it also has less range.}}
*{{nerf|New forward aerial has more startup lag with a shorter duration (frames 11-26 → 18-22) and has more ending lag (frame 40 → 60). It is a less reliable [[edgeguarding]] move overall due to the introduction of meteor canceling. It also deals less damage (16% → 15%) and knockback (10 (base), 100 (scaling) → 30/70), and has less combo potential, now being one of the weakest forward aerials, and it also has less range.}}
*{{buff|[[Back aerial]] is more useful for [[edgeguarding]] as it has less startup lag with a longer duration (frames 10-19 → 6-17) and ending lag (frame 40 → 29) making it a more effective [[wall of pain]].}}
*{{buff|[[Back aerial]] is more useful for [[edgeguarding]] as it has less startup lag with a longer duration (frames 10-19 → 6-17) and ending lag (frame 40 → 29) making it a more effective [[wall of pain]].}}
*{{nerf|Back aerial deals less damage (16% (clean), 10% (late) → 11%/9%) and has lower knockback.}}
*{{nerf|Back aerial deals less damage (16% (clean), 10% (late) → 11%/9%) greatly hindering the sweetspot's KO potential although the sourspot's base knockback was compensated (0 → 7).}}
*{{change|Back aerial has a new animation, where Mario kicks more sideways with his right side facing up, instead of kicking backward face-down. Mario also recovers differently without curling up into a flip.}}
*{{change|Back aerial has a new animation, where Mario kicks more sideways with his right side facing up, instead of kicking backward face-down. Mario also recovers differently without curling up into a flip.}}
*{{buff|Up aerial has less ending lag (frame 40 → 30).}}
*{{buff|Up aerial has less ending lag (frame 40 → 30).}}
**{{nerf|Despite this, Mario can no longer perform two up aerials in a short hop due to his higher fall speed and lower short hop.}}
**{{nerf|Despite this, Mario can no longer perform two up aerials in a short hop due to his higher fall speed and lower short hop.}}
*{{nerf|[[Up aerial]] has more startup lag with a shorter duration (frames 2-11 → 4-9) and deals 1% less damage (12% → 11%). The sourspot is also no longer able to combo into moves such as itself and up smash as easily.}}
*{{nerf|[[Up aerial]] has more startup lag with a shorter duration (frames 2-11 → 4-9), deals 1% less damage (12% → 11%) and has reduced knockback scaling (120 → 100). The sourspot is also no longer able to combo into moves such as itself and up smash as easily.}}
*{{change|Up aerial's angle changed (80° (clean), 70° (late) → 55°). This improves its edgeguarding potential but hinders its juggling and combo potential.}}
*{{change|Up aerial's angle changed (80° (clean), 70° (late) → 55°). This improves its edgeguarding potential but hinders its juggling and combo potential. It also no longer has a weaker late hit.}}
*{{buff|Down aerial no longer has set knockback on its last hit, which combined with its new horizontal launch angle gives it the ability to set up edgeguards, and makes it a much more consistent gimping option overall. It additionally has a landing hitbox that improves its combo potential. It also has less ending lag (frame 39 → 38).}}
*{{buff|Down aerial has less ending lag (frame 39 → 38).}}
*{{nerf|[[Down aerial]] has a much lower maximum damage output (24% → 10%), it can only hit the target 7 times instead of 8, and is no longer a meteor smash. It can also no longer setup moves such as up aerial and up tilt as easily due to L-canceling being less effective. Mario can also no longer perform another aerial after it in a short hop.}}
*{{change|Down aerial now has a landing hitbox.}}
*{{nerf|[[Down aerial]] has a much lower maximum damage output (24% → 10%), it can only hit the target 7 times instead of 8, and is no longer a meteor smash (-70° → 94°) removing its edgeguarding potential and making it connect less reliably. It can also no longer setup moves such as up aerial and up tilt as easily due to its new angle along with L-canceling being less effective. Mario can also no longer perform another aerial after it in a short hop.}}


===Grabs and throws===
===Grabs and throws===
*{{buff|Mario now has a [[pummel]], [[up throw]] and a [[down throw]], increasing his options out of a grab. He can also [[chaingrab]] characters with said throws.}}
*{{buff|Mario now has a [[pummel]], [[up throw]] and a [[down throw]], increasing his options out of a grab. He can also [[chaingrab]] characters with said throws.}}
*{{nerf|Grabs have more startup lag (frame 6 → 7 (standing), 11 (dash)) and ending lag (frame 16 → 31 (standing), 41 (dash)).}}
*{{nerf|Grabs have more startup lag (frame 6 → 7 (standing), 11 (dash)) and ending lag (frame 16 → 31 (standing), 41 (dash)).}}
*{{nerf|Back throw deals less damage (16% (throw)/12% (collateral) → 12% (throw)/10% (collateral)) and knockback (30 (base), 80 (scaling → 80/65), making it much weaker.}}
*{{nerf|Back throw deals less damage (16% (throw)/12% (collateral) → 12% (throw)/10% (collateral)) and knockback (70 (base), 70 (scaling → 80/65), making it much weaker.}}
*{{nerf|Forward throw deals less damage (12% → 9%).}}
*{{nerf|Forward throw deals less damage (12% → 9%) and knockback (80 (base), 70 (scaling) → 60/65).}}


===Special moves===
===Special moves===
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*{{nerf|Fireballs are smaller and deal 1% less damage (7% (US/PAL) → 6%).}}
*{{nerf|Fireballs are smaller and deal 1% less damage (7% (US/PAL) → 6%).}}
*{{change|Mario's side special, [[Cape]], allows him to deal better with [[camp]]ing and gives him a additional recovery option while in the air. It is also a deadly edgeguarding tool, making Mario one of the best edgeguarders in the game.}}
*{{change|Mario's side special, [[Cape]], allows him to deal better with [[camp]]ing and gives him a additional recovery option while in the air. It is also a deadly edgeguarding tool, making Mario one of the best edgeguarders in the game.}}
*{{buff|Super Jump Punch can now be canceled with a wall jump near the apex of the move, further aiding Mario's recovery.}}
*{{buff|[[Super Jump Punch]] can now be canceled with a wall jump near the apex of the move, further aiding Mario's recovery.}}
*{{nerf|[[Super Jump Punch]] has more startup lag (frame 2 → 3), has less [[intangibility]] (frames 2-5 → 3-5), gains much less distance and deals slightly less damage (15% → 14%).}}
*{{change|Super Jump Punch's first few hits (110 (set) → 130) and the final hit (0 (base), 170 (scaling) → 40/140) have altered knockback.}}
*{{buff|The last hit of [[Mario Tornado]] no longer has set knockback, allowing it to KO at high percentages. Mario Tornado also has less ending lag (frame 87 → 80).}}
*{{nerf|Super Jump Punch has more startup lag (frame 2 → 3), has less [[intangibility]] (frames 2-5 → 3-5), gains much less distance and deals slightly less damage (15% → 14%).}}
*{{nerf|Mario Tornado has more startup lag (frame 1 → 8) and no longer meteor smashes. It also can only hit 8 times instead of 14, deals less damage (14% → 10%), its first hit deals no knockback, and it now has a delay before the last hit allowing foes to escape the attack more easily. Due to this, the move is now considered nearly useless outside of recovering, and as a situational vertical launcher.}}
*{{buff|The last hit of [[Mario Tornado]] no longer has set knockback (120 (base), 0 (scaling) → 60/115), allowing it to KO at high percentages. Mario Tornado also has less ending lag (frame 87 → 80).}}
*{{nerf|Mario Tornado has more startup lag (frame 1 → 8), can only hit 8 times instead of 14, deals less damage (14% → 10%), its first hit deals no knockback, and it now has a delay before the last hit allowing foes to escape the attack more easily. Due to this, the move is now considered nearly useless outside of recovering, and as a situational vertical launcher.}}


===PAL differences===
===PAL differences===
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