Smasher talk:Brookman

Aside from having found Melee Hell, which has been a safe haven for trolls in the Super Smash Bros. community, why is Brookman's article still up?

76.232.209.63 05:40, 16 November 2015 (EST)
 * I would like to argue that. Anything famous is gonna have trolls/vandals. [[file:INoMedssig.png|20px]]  INoMed (Talk •  Contribs) 05:48, 16 November 2015 (EST)
 * Actually, this is fair enough IMO. Melee Hell isn't really high-level content, so the smasher isn't notable unless they have tournament results. Nyargleblargle.png Nyargle blargle (Talk | Contribs) 06:21, 16 November 2015 (EST)

Double Standards Ahoy
It's sad to see that while LGBT smashers, even some of its best, aren't featured on here, the anti-LGBT norm will let obscure smashers get pages. 107.77.85.95 17:09, 16 March 2016 (EDT)
 * I guess both Melee Hell and being ranked 2nd on Connecticut's Power Rankings mean almost nothing when it comes to importance, right? You can argue with the Wiki about whether or not that's notable, but let me address your LGBT comment. We never deleted, nor tried to make, a Smasher page on Mufasa or Origins or whatever other LGBT Smasher you want to name. Is it because of some stupid conspiracy on Smash Wiki that makes LGBT Smashers illegitimate to write about? No. It's us not bothering to do it yet. If our lack of LGBT smashers is disparaging, please keep in mind that nothing is really stopping you from making those pages yourself. Yes, I'm aware that you can't make the pages because you don't have an account. However, you could just make an account or post the coding for us to copy-paste instead of trying to go all social-justice warrior on us. Mega  Tron1  Decepticon.png 20:22, 16 March 2016 (EDT)

I fail to see how being "anti-LGBT" (however absurd that claim is) has anything to do with the deletion discussion of this page. Please clarify Serpent    King   14:40, 20 March 2016 (EDT)

Re: Double Standards Ahoy
107.xx.xx.xx (redacted for safety), I understand what you mean by your concern(s). Apparently, I've researched on LGBT smashers, and some of the reasons, factors, etc., regarding why we don't hear about them much can applicably include, but are not limited to:

(1): Safety; some tournaments are hot spots of theft, like 42 Ale House, where people, including smashers, have gotten things stolen, most notoriously LGBT smasher Origins | Mufasa's memory card. After he told someone about the problem on problem, he was inexplicably called a "bitch" for bringing up the theft that happened. Plus, it doesn't help that there have been LGBT smashers, especially those on Facebook, who are likelier to be abused, harassed, robbed, etc. in the community than other smashers. As a fellow LGBT smasher, I can try to understand your perspective.

(2): Stereotypes; some Smashers have made stereotypes, most often about gays/lesbians. One of them is that only homosexuals main Peach, which is clearly false, because your sexual orientation, race, etc. should not determine who your main is. I'm bisexual, and I play a good number of characters.

(3): Population; LGBT smashers, whether male, female, etc., are a vast minority in the Super Smash Bros. community. However, possibly because of reasons #1 and #2, not all LGBT smashers are openly homo/bi/trans-sexual.

(4): Representation vs. Tokenism; before Origins | Mufasa, there were no known Midwest smashers in the LGBT community. As of March 2016, he has been the token openly-bisexual smasher in the whole SSB community, and has had a high wall to notability to climb up, so to speak. Historically, there have been smashers speculated to be in the LGBT spectrum, and MacD has been a hot topic, regarding where in the spectrum he is.

(4): Inequality and its Denial; although I have known smashers who are homo/bi-sexual, there is a notable LGBT smasher I know who has had his information leaked onto the internet and whenever he tries to make a name for himself: anything factual about him is eventually deleted, and he's told to "go f himself" by other smashers. To make matters worse, this behavior has been rewarded by the community itself. Sadly, inequality denial has been trending in recent years in the SSB community, and those who try to have LGBT and non-LGBT smashers be treated indiscriminately equal have been silenced by force, accused of being social justice warriors, and/or even scorned for wanting the LGBT equality we have yet to reach in the Super Smash Bros. community. Take Event Horizon Gaming for example, where LGBT smashers can't commentate on the Twitch stream.

With those factors to consider, don't feel discouraged about making a difference. Just know that not all smashers are Gamergaters who want to exclude the LGBT smashers from the community.

76.232.209.63 11:16, 30 March 2016 (EDT)


 * "107.xx.xx.xx (redacted for safety)"
 * We can all see his/her IP. There's really no need to do that.
 * "Your entire post"
 * From what I understand, you're basically lending your support to the IP. As nice as that is, your discussion of discrimination isn't really relevant to us. Maybe it's more relevant to Smashboards, where the smashers who harass people actually gather. Your response is appreciated, but we didn't discourage the IP from making pages for LGBT smashers, so it's sorta falling on deaf ears. The IP just decided to leave the Wiki immediately after treating us like we were the oppressors to his/her LGBT smashers. Mega  Tron1  Decepticon.png 12:37, 30 March 2016 (EDT)

Actually, Megatron; it isn't just the Smashboards users who have shown anti-LGBT tendencies; a couple months ago, a category to highlight LGBT smashers was planned (similar to how female smashers have been highlighted based on their sex), but the majority SSBwiki users wouldn't have it, and thus will never be a category. Plus, there have been people who tried informing others of LGBT smashers, yet corrupt users like Omega Tyrant will always find an excuse to delete pages on LGBT smashers' pages, which I know would transpire again. The only exception to this ban is MacD, who is among the most notable smashers in the LGBT spectrum, alongside notable enough to earn his own page, which shows some progress. The reason why I didn't respond right away was that I felt my efforts were just gateways to feeling like none of them went anywhere. Even if modern LGBT smashers do find a way on here, can I say they'll feel welcomed? Right now, the answer is sometimes ambiguous, albeit I have also known a few smashers who have friends of varying sexual orientations, and can make the community more welcoming of smashers, regardless of their sexuality, whether hetero, homo, bi, etc. Until then, I plan to boycott most of the SSB streams, such as Event Horizon Gaming.

107.77.83.21 11:36, 2 April 2016 (EDT)
 * SmashWiki is not a place where anyone should feel unwelcome on the basis of anything related to this issue. Whether a Smasher page is tagged for deletion or a category is created are matters of consistency in article design, not an attempt to specifically highlight or diminish aspects of the community. If you have a disagreement with a specific instance of page management, that's one thing; however, your perception of a wider pattern here doesn't seem to have a basis. Miles ( talk)   11:45, 2 April 2016 (EDT)


 * The reason why I didn't respond right away was that I felt my efforts were just gateways to feeling like none of them went anywhere. Even if modern LGBT smashers do find a way on here, can I say they'll feel welcomed?
 * Apathy. I really don't understand this. One person can make a difference. Go make the pages instead of doing the equivalency of feminist on tumblr.
 * Plus, there have been people who tried informing others of LGBT smashers, yet corrupt users like Omega Tyrant will always find an excuse to delete pages on LGBT smashers' pages, which I know would transpire again.
 * You say this, but you didn't present evidence. I ran a check on OT's deletion logs. Nothing related to the terms "gay", "homo", or "LGBT" outside of vandalism pages. If you're going to make the claim that users are oppressing you, you have to bring up the evidence. Any claims that this would transpire again would be completely incorrect, unless you haven't read a single thing we posted so far. You keep on bringing up that the Wiki will somehow delete your things, but you haven't presented a single piece of evidence yet. If a bullshit deletion happened simply because of sexual preference, then please, bring up the page, and we'll take a look at it. Mega  Tron1  Decepticon.png 13:41, 2 April 2016 (EDT)