SmashWiki talk:Community portal/Archive 0

'''I was bold and I moved the Main Page Talk to this Pool Room archive, because I wanted to specify where we keep our discussion. You may continue to make a few last comments, but I suggest you bring discussion here to a close, or bring the issues to the main Pool Room page.'''

20:08, January 30, 2007 (GMT)

oddeven2002: Congrats on becoming an offical Wiki site! I will (hopefully) finish the stages tomorrow, it someone wants to put pictures on there, you would be my hero.
 * Hey, thanks for helping us out. For what it's worth a little while back I created a section on stages for Melee World here. Feel free to copy and paste the content from those pages over. I did Corneria already, but I think the page design might still need some work. (Don't let that stop you, though.) -- Kirby King 03:43, July 26, 2006 (GMT)

-- Mr Ng: So, um, just to let all y'all know, Mr Ng = TheIceDragon = Sars_Pirate. >_> That is all.

oddeven2002: Oh! Ok, Hi TID, Thanks for helping me out with character Pros and Cons.

Editing Talk Pages
Talk pages are way easier to follow when everything's in a section and everyone signs their post at the end (click the signature icon in the bar above the edit box). 'Cause you know, it's how Wikipedia does it, and if it's good enough for them.... -- Kirby King 03:43, July 26, 2006 (GMT)

o_o Whee! --Pyoro T 22:24, July 27, 2006 (GMT)

Image captions on character pages
I've removed the image captions for several characters from their pages. IMO saying "Peach, from the Super Mario Bros." series in the infobox at the top of Peach is redundant, and the extra border is unnecessary. (For clarity, these captions are under the first picture at the top of each article, within the character intro table.) --Nealdt 01:08, July 30, 2006 (GMT)

SSB vs SSBM character pages
Should characters who appear in both SSB and SSBM (and, by extension, SSBB) have separate pages for each game? Along the lines of Mario (SSB), Mario (SSBM), and Mario (SSBB), with Mario having general information about the character and links to each game page? I think this is the most logical way to separate information from the three games, since facts like tier/ranking, strengths/weaknesses, and move lists obviously change from game to game. --Nealdt 01:47, July 30, 2006 (GMT)


 * Check User:Kirby King/Character disambiguation. I'm not sure if we should include generic information about the character on the disambiguation page, but I'm guessing whatever we did include we could link to on the other pages (and for characters only appearing in one game, we'd include it on the same page as we do now). -- Kirby King 17:11, July 30, 2006 (GMT)


 * Well, I guess now's as good as any a time to bring this question back. All our character articles have copious information about their SSBM self, but we have very little SSB-oriented information. Should we add such information in a separate article, perhaps Mario (SSB) or Mario/SSB?  Some of the character articles are incredibly long as it is (Peach is SmashWiki's biggest article). --MaskedMarth 18:03, December 13, 2006 (GMT)

Where can we go to debate character traits
The Wiki team should have a meeting place or maybe we can get together at a chatroom or something so we can discuss things that we bicker over. There are some details that I'd like to address with the characters, but I don't want to change anything without general agreement. --Mr Ng 04:31, July 30, 2006 (GMT


 * That's what talk pages are for. Use the tab that says "discussion" on top of a page, and if you don't get any feedback, you can assume there aren't any objections. (If there are, the objectors should leave a comment to that effect on the talk page, at least after you make the changes. Or, even if they don't, you'll see who they are when the edit the page back.) -- Kirby King 04:34, July 30, 2006 (GMT)

I believe we need to have a completely seperate character page for each game. --Peaches


 * That's a suggestion that floated around in my mind, but I never wrote down. One problem is that we don't have any SSB strategies for characters, and few if any of the editors here know much about competitive SSB (correct me if I'm wrong, of course).  For the time being I should think it best to keep most of the articles Melee-oriented (including the characters), but it should be an eventual goal to fully incorporate SSB64 (and Brawl) into the Wiki. --MaskedMarth 03:43, January 10, 2007 (GMT)


 * Well, it seems I'm too late. It looks like Jigglypuff (SSB) is working out nicely - I haven't seen if any other articles have started that direction. --MaskedMarth 03:49, January 10, 2007 (GMT)

What links should we provide in the character specific sections?
After looking through MookieRah's work, I think that every character needs a set of links for players to refer to. The first should be the best FAQ for that character we can find. If there isn't one, too bad. :( Next should be video tutorials and links to combo vids since those will show players how to play and what happens when you apply all this knowledge. And the last thing, we should decide whether or not we want a mass compilation of 1 vs 1s. This is easy to come by for low tier/odd characters since there are threads like this floating around on smashboards. But the problem comes in when we get to higher tier characters, we may have to start from scratch and compile a crapload of vids because of their popularity.--Mr Ng 04:34, July 31, 2006 (GMT)

Bug in Articles
I noticed that 2 pages can be created with the same name but different case such as Wall of Pain and Wall of pain, but 1 cannot be redirected to the other it seems. Anything we can do to fix this problem? --Simna ibn Sind 08:33, August 4, 2006 (GMT)
 * They do, in fact, redirect to each other. --nealdt 16:18, August 4, 2006 (GMT)


 * wow....it did fix....i wondr if it was my browser cache or something causing it for me...--Simna ibn Sind 01:38, August 5, 2006 (GMT)

Player pages
Ok, these are getting out of hand. Who are Gooba, JaCk, and the 500 other people who suddenly have their own pages on this wiki? Are we suddenly making a page for every single person to ever play the game? What use is this to the general Smash public? Keep this sorta stuff on the GSC and not on a wiki. If people want a page about themselves, let them create a user page. We have an entire namespace for them, after all. --nealdt 05:17, August 5, 2006 (GMT)

That's my doing. I didn't realize there was a limit to what can be put on here. What I am doing is making pages about things that are part of the smash bros community to provide info to everyone. I am not putting up any false info or even opinions(so and so is a pro cause i think he is). Also, Ken didn't make his own page, sum1 made it for him. I am also responisble for the Smashers category where all the added names are listed. Not all smashers are gonna come to this wiki and having info on them here is legitimate info. People coming to this wiki wont have to wade thru player pages to get to what they want, so they arent in anyone's way. Is there a limit to the amount of things that can go into this wiki? --Simna ibn Sind 05:32, August 5, 2006 (GMT)

Also, I added the entire GSC list of players from Europe and Asia to the smashwiki, but I will stop for now until we talk about this more...and i imagine a lot of US players will probably be adding themselves while im not.--Simna ibn Sind 05:35, August 5, 2006 (GMT)


 * There is no technical limit (aside from database size) on what can and cannot be on here. It's more a question of keeping things clean and organized, and focusing our efforts on information that the general public will find useful. It doesn't help that we haven't set out a clear outline of what we want this wiki to be ("everything about Smash" isn't very helpful). I personally feel that no one should have a personal page outside of the User: namespace except for influential smashers (tournament winners, trailblazers, and others that the majority of the community recognize as influential), and that page should be about their influence, not just a list of all their cool accomplishments and why they're so awesome. But that's just my opinion. Clearly we need to have an official talk about this. Kirby King? --nealdt 05:48, August 5, 2006 (GMT)


 * Neal, agreed that not everyone needs their own page, but I don't think we should make it a particular chore to erase all these pages. If they want their fifteen minutes of fame, let them have it, and we have the "Pros" page for all the major influences.  However, we should put a stated rule somewhere that says don't make a player page if you don't have anything important to share (I am in fact guilty of making the Rupee crew page), to keep out unneccesary clutter. --Technomancer 10:50, August 5, 2006 (GMT)


 * One of the things that's bothering me is that there are a number of User pages that simply redirect to that person's entry in the main namespace. It's okay if you include a link to your page on your user page (I guess, at least as long as you have one), but user pages really should be primarily for users in the context of this wiki. Especially if someone wants to leave you a message, and doesn't notice that when they click your name and then "talk," they're leaving a message in the wrong place. As for whether or not we should include pages for everyone to ever play Smash, I tend to think we shouldn't. I started SmashWiki:Scope to try to address the topics we want to include on the wiki, but don't think that that's at all complete at this point (and don't mind the fact that it's currently based on a list of goals that does not, as of yet, exist). Even if we do include pages on a lot of different people, however, I do insist that only those who may be objectively considered "major players" be on any compilation lists of major players (or pros, or whatever term you want to use). This is simply in the name of usefulness; a list of everyone to ever play doesn't benefit the community at all (as has been said). At the same time, a page about an insignificant player that no one ever links to doesn't do anyone any good either, but I won't get too far into that right now. -- Kirby King 17:09, August 5, 2006 (GMT)


 * Should we put a number cap on the amount of players from a region per character? I know we'll be excluding a lot and make judgements on who we think are better, but I think that five per character should be enough (5 because of the ridiculous amount of Fox/Peach/etc players). Also, if we do decide to do a number cap, we should aim at being more diverse and include players who are notable for having different play styles (Mike G's Peach compared to Vidjo's Peach).

I still don't see a reason why not to. Smash info is smash info an if there is no limit to the number of pages that this thing can have then how is it any kind of problem at all? Even with any player making their own page we could still easily separate the more influential ones from teh regular ones by number of links to those players and by the categories they are in. --Simna ibn Sind 04:04, August 6, 2006 (GMT)


 * One reason, which may not be significant enough on its own, would be, as I'm clicking Random page to look for something new or exciting, half the time it goes to some players page, who I've never heard of, and it basically only says who they play, which is not really interesting or exciting to learn. Perhaps if you put in a story or biography for each one then that would warrant adding new players. --ender 21:43, August 28, 2006 (GMT)


 * I have the same problem. I actually use random page to look for articles about key subjects that are poorly written (so I can improve them and stuff), but I don't want to edit an article about some Peach player in Missouri I've never heard of.  I'm not littering SmashWiki with a page about my Smashing skill (or lack thereof).  Though I'm a longtime member of GameFAQs and Smashboards, I haven't had enough influence on the Smash community to merit an article.  Similarly, almost everybody with a Smash page does not deserve one.  We should catalogue crews that have great geographic importance (Smash-Mex, TSA), and players with at least some influence in the community (everyone from Ken to KishSquared), but I'd keep it to that. --MaskedMarth 08:15, September 29, 2006 (GMT)

Either some panel should vote on the notability of players and delete useless pages about LinkMaster007 and noobRoy89, or there should be a category for notable smashers. Perhaps that should replace the pro category--I don't even know what pro means, but it seems to imply skilled players and not important contributors so much. I don't like it. And per se Andy 01:12, January 27, 2007 (GMT)
 * Whoa, no one has been talking about this for a long time? Well, I think it's important. And per se Andy 01:14, January 27, 2007 (GMT)
 * Well, it's been on the backburner for a while but it's still a problem. I don't think it's TOO much of a problem to let random people have their own page (at this stage we need to invite people to help, and they'll be driven away if we're snippy about notability), but I agree that we should distinguish the important Smashers from the random LinkMaster007s. I don't know how we'd set up such a panel.  The best thing I can do, for now, is to improve articles about the important Smashers, like Isai or Azen.  21:07, January 28, 2007 (GMT)

Autoredirect
I'm helping out with the trophy section of the wiki and I created the [Mario & Yoshi:trophy] article. Everything was fine while I was creating it until I was finished and it decided to autoredirect me to the Mario page. I even tried recreating it and eliminating the spaces by making the [Mario&Yoshi:trophy] page, but I was still redirected. Why does this happen? Shuold I use 'and' instead of '&'? --Simna ibn Sind 04:24, August 7, 2006 (GMT)

Yeah, and would be more appropriate. Ampersands are used in the URL for PHP direction, so what you're doing, is using the ampersand to block the URL at "Mario". --Pyoro T 00:44, August 27, 2006 (GMT)

Techniques and Strategies
Since these sections have still not been created, should we continue to link to them from the main page? It seems to me that "gameplay" encompasses everything "techniques" would include, anyways, and nobody has ever catalogued "strategies" in a meaningful way. --MaskedMarth 14:30, October 17, 2006 (GMT)

Article of the day
We aren't big enough (and we have too few good articles) to start doing this, but to encourage people to write articles well we could start doing something like an "article of the week." Just an idea. The main page looks a little sparse. --MaskedMarth 15:03, October 17, 2006 (GMT)

SmashWiki on Wikipedia
Since early September, I have been hard at work using my "bureaucracy" talent to attempt to get Smash Wiki on the wikipedia, SSBM page for external links. I have been denied with the following message:

"The fact it's newer, means it shouldn't be in external links yet. Wikipedia isn't the place to spam your fan sites and/or personal wiki sites. "

I gave the link, and I'd bet that the person didn't even so much as go to the site and look around. Really, I'm still fighting and biting and grinding, but I won't rest untill I see this Wiki on that Wiki. - Oddeven2002


 * And remember: the biggest factor in this happening is the quality of this Wiki! Not only must new pages be created, but those existing pages must be expanded and improved! Also, I feel that we should focus on filling the main body of work, beginning with characters/stages/items, i.e., all things regarded the game directly first. Second priority should be community promotion, linking of sites (SWF, MLG, Smash Dojo) and information on the competitive scene. Finally should come crew pages and individual smashers. While all of these things should be done, our goals need prioritization to be successful.--Delphiki 00:53, October 30, 2006 (GMT)


 * You're absolutely right. We need another wave of activity. I'm sure we all can admit that we have been rather lazy about this site, and I vow to improve my habits and help out a lot more. Let's all do that! I really am sorry for not being as active as I should be, and I will continue my Smashwiki work. We need motivation people! Here's a list of priorities in order from greatest need, from least need.

1. Detail, fillers, info, EXPANSION! Let's get this site filled! 2. Advertisement, threads on whatever Smash forums you have. 4. More active SmashWiki members. 3. More information on individual smashers and crews.

I really want to see this site really soar! Starting today, this will be a new site, I swear it. No looking back now.Oddeven2002 05:17, October 30, 2006 (GMT)


 * I'll definitely help out...I already advertise the smashwiki like everywhere^_^--Simna ibn Sind 09:58, October 30, 2006 (GMT)

More advertising is always a good idea. I'll take a step back from my personal projects to fix up the high-traffic pages, until SmashWiki is presentable. --MaskedMarth 17:19, October 30, 2006 (GMT)

Trophy Images
Up until now i have been the only one making and editting trophy pages, but recently some others have started to. I have been careful to collect pictures of the trophies that do not have the watermark from another website, but recently some pics have been put up with emblems from other sites on them....here is an example: [Igglybuff (trophy)]. I want to know if we should worry about that.--Simna ibn Sind 00:07, November 7, 2006 (GMT)

Yeah, I wasn't sure whether or not that it was OK, so I just posted the URL instead of uploading the image. That way it would be easier to remove, in case it was decided against. --Respawn 00:35, November 7, 2006 (GMT)

Import
Sorry, before I actually knew this wiki existed (I DID Google) I made a crappy hosted wiki at smashbros.elwiki.com. Now, I want you to import pages please. – Smiddle / talk 21:00, November 13, 2006 (GMT)


 * I just looked at your wiki, and it's designed quite well. I like the main page and the navigation better there than here.  We should definitely incorporate some of those elements into this wiki.  And, of course, import worthy articles. --MaskedMarth 14:57, December 22, 2006 (GMT)


 * Did you like it? Thanks. Hope they will import them soon. – Smiddle / talk 18:46, January 7, 2007 (GMT)

1000 hits
The main page has almost 1000 hits now < (   - '.' - <  )   – Smiddle / talk 20:28, December 15, 2006 (GMT)

You mean 10,000. Of course, a lot of these are the same people "hitting" the main page every other time they log on. --MaskedMarth 20:28, December 20, 2006 (GMT)


 * Yeah, 10000. – Smiddle / talk 18:46, January 7, 2007 (GMT)

good news^_^
im happy to report that smashwiki is fully usable with the WII BROWSER!--Simna ibn Sind 12:13, December 22, 2006 (GMT)

SHWING! Haha, that's great! --MaskedMarth 14:51, December 22, 2006 (GMT)

Score! I can't wait to try it out (with my Wii I got on launch day, ) I hope they're won't be any annoying kinks, I can't help but feel that's going to be an issue. Maybe I'm just a pesimist. Oddeven2002 20:31, December 22, 2006 (GMT)

I still don't have one... *sulks in corner* I thought the Wii was supposed to use Opera... or is that just a dowloadable option? If it does use Opera, then there shouldn't be any problems. --Respawn 21:19, December 22, 2006 (GMT)

Character Match-ups
While perusing the Samus board on SWF, I came across Aftermath's guide to Samus. I really like how this page was designed (besides the 1st person viewpoint), and I noticed that at the bottom it had sections for match-ups against certain characters. So I thought, wouldn't it be a nice addition if SmashWiki included pages for character match-ups? I think it would be best if each character had a page for their match-ups separate from the actual character pages, so as not to clutter them up. For example, you could have a Samus Character Match-up page, and several strategies for every character (opponent) would be featured on that page, each with its own little section. Just a thought, tell me what you think.--Respawn 23:40, January 4, 2007 (GMT)


 * I like it, especially considering that some character pages (particularly Peach and Mewtwo) are way too large. Maybe we can tie this into Phanna's matchup chart, considering both projects seem to be of the same spirit. --MaskedMarth 00:34, January 5, 2007 (GMT)


 * Yeah, but how often does phanna update that? I can only recall two or three updates, but I could be wrong. Back to the topic at hand, is that a green light to start this thing? I don't want to go off on some big project without proper consent first. I want to make sure I've got the format ready, so that the pages don't require a bunch of cleanup.--Respawn 00:15, January 9, 2007 (GMT)


 * You have my strong support. What I was thinking about, with the comment about phanna's project, is that it would be much quicker to incorporate a "living document" on a Wiki than when it is run by just one person.  Your idea has the same goal as phanna's project and now-defunct RiTT, but is much more likely to succeed than either. --MaskedMarth 19:59, January 9, 2007 (GMT)

Alright, I've begun setting it up. For ideas and suggestions on format, please go here. I have yet to place phanna's pic in there, if you or anybody else wants to do that, I think it would look nice on the category page. Edit: I just took a look at RiTT, (for the first time). Let me guess... MaskedSheik? (lol) Anyways, I took a look around, quite complicated yet in-depth. Definitely a place to go for some ideas .--Respawn 21:27, January 9, 2007 (GMT)

Kudos!
As of late, this site has become significantly more active. I've noticed it. The site's not done yet, but it's certainly going somewhere! Thanks for all the work you ALL put in, guys. Good job. Oddeven2002 18:07, January 13, 2007 (GMT)
 * What the first guy said – Smiddle / talk 19:05, January 13, 2007 (GMT)
 * Sweet! --MaskedMarth 19:44, January 13, 2007 (GMT)
 * I've noticed it too. I'm a regular on the GameFAQs SSBB boards (Under the name Missing_My_Head), and people have been linking to and asking about the site quite a bit. WaluigiIsAwesome 07:47, January 24, 2007 (GMT)

Mergism thoughts?
In SSB, Meowth is a Pokemon that comes out of a Poke-Ball. In SSBM, Meowth is a trophy. These are two very separate representations of the character, sure, but are they meant to stay in separate pages? Or should there be one Meowth page that talks about both? I'm not very sure yet how specific SmashWiki wants to be with these sorts of things. Erik the Appreciator 00:05, January 25, 2007 (GMT)


 * I'm also noticing how Andross covers both SSBM trophies in one page, which is inconsistent with the Meowth example above. There'll need to be some level of consistency in covering characters that occur in various forms in the SSB series. Here's my proposal: Wherever applicable, make articles based on and named after the Ninteno character and have it go into detail all the appearances and cameos of that character throughout the Smash games. The article on Andross should provide a general description and backstory to the character Andross as seen in the Star Fox series, then have a section detailing his common trophy, then have a section detailing his rare trophy. Likewise, the article on Chansey should provide Pokedex-based info first as the page's character exposition, then an SSB section about Chansey with subsections about how it appears as a Poke-Ball Pokemon in SSB and then how it appears in the Saffron City stage, and then an SSBM section about Chansey with subsections about how it appears as a Poke-Ball Item in SSBM and as a Trophy. I think it works best for the people who would go through the trouble to type down Andross or Chansey in the Search feature. Erik the Appreciator 00:26, January 25, 2007 (GMT)

URL
www.smashwiki.com brings you to a blank page with "Nothing to see here." Wouldn't it be nice if it redirected to the main index?And per se Andy 19:23, January 26, 2007 (GMT)
 * Agree.


 * I think that's because we're waiting for the site to be presentable before the "Grand Opening". Once we get everything all set up, they'll probably redirect it.--Respawn 21:58, January 26, 2007 (GMT)

Whoa...Is this just my computer, or do we have a problem?
When I search for the word "Shell," it brings up a "403 - Forbidden" error message. Now, my current computer is about as intelligent as a block of styrofoam, and my internet connection leaves a lot to be desired, so it may just be me, but can someone else try it on their computer? I'll try it on some of my others. WaluigiIsAwesome 09:53, January 27, 2007 (GMT)
 * I tried it again on my iMac, which uses Safari for internet browsing, as opposed to Internet Explorer, and it was fine. Maybe is has something to do with IE? I dunno... WaluigiIsAwesome 09:55, January 27, 2007 (GMT)
 * I use IE6 on Windows XP, the same happened to me WTFzorz. 13:12, January 27, 2007 (GMT)


 * No problem with Firefox. Why would you use IE anyway? =) And per se Andy 22:20, January 28, 2007 (GMT)


 * Because it sucks. 14:20, January 30, 2007 (GMT)


 * Eh, it's just the browser that came with my computer. I'm switching to an iMac, soon, anyway. Just have to transfer my files. WaluigiIsAwesome 10:38, January 29, 2007 (GMT)


 * But, anyway, we'll need to fix this. "Shell" seems to cause problems for IE. And it doesn't have to just be Shell on its own. You can type in anything, and if Shell is in there, it goes nuts. Any theories on why the heck this would happen? WaluigiIsAwesome 06:37, January 30, 2007 (GMT)


 * Hmm, it happens with IE7 too. And per se Andy 15:12, January 30, 2007 (GMT)

Archive me!
*Navi voice* LISTEN! I recommend we move all discussion on Talk:Main Page to SmashWiki:Community Portal. It would seem best to centralize all general discussion on one page, instead of having it in two random locations. 01:43, January 30, 2007 (GMT)